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Thread: Intricate piercing saw recommendations?

  1. #1
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    Default Intricate piercing saw recommendations?

    Hi everyone. I’m a beginner student silversmith and I’m keen to improve my intricate piercing design skills. Can anyone recommend the best saw frame and blades for such a task?

    I’ve had little success with my current set up: a cheap saw frame for everyday piercing in class (Eclipse PS51 which cost about £10), used usually with a 2/0 blade.
    I’ve tried using thinner blades like a 6/0, but they are impossible to secure firmly into the saw frame. The thin blade actually breaks whilst trying to secure it, i.e. before I’ve even started sawing! If I donmange to secure the blade is rather floppy in the frame. That’s why I’m thinking of changing saw frame.

    Any tips or recommendations would be much appreciated.
    I’ve had a look at the Knew concept frames on Cookson but have no idea which would be best.

  2. #2
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    You don't need to replace the frame, but the sawblade should match the thickness of the metal you are piercing and there are guides on the forum to assist you. I've got an Eclipse frame and love it to bits and happily saw with a no 5 (for chainmaille), or with a no 2 blade for thicker sheet. I have a knew concept saw but have had problems with it since buying, years ago and it sits in my desk gathering dust. I'd say a no 6 is a bit too fine to start with and would probably go with a 4 or 5??? Its all about practice tbh. good luck
    Jules

  3. #3
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    I’ve had an eclipse for decades, it must still be the college saw of choice. I only bought a Knew Concept because everyone was raving about them and it’s lighter. It took me a long time to get used to but I mostly use it, I still sometimes go back to my eclipse though i5 won’t be thrown out as it’s a good saw
    I use Size 4 saw blades for everything or sometimes what comes out of the tray which end up breaking or are too coarse so I would imagine they were a mistaken buy at some point.
    The 6 is too fine and will probably break if you tension it too much, the eclipse doesn’t do that fine very well. You do have to tension the eclipse between your chest and the bench peg while putting the blade in and once screwed up there should be a ping in the blade when you flick it. I still tension my KC in the same way, even though it’s a screw tension, out of habit.
    If you do a search on saws there was a post recently but I’d change the blades and it’s just practice.
    I’ve been away from the bench for a while and the order of the day for me has been wavy lines instead of straight, I’m hoping to get my eye back soon but I’ve bought new files to repair the damage!

  4. #4
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    I have an old eclipse, that I still keep loaded with a thick blade (platinum king 0 or 1) for stainless steel and alloy, but most of my saws are now KC - not least because I find the light weight very convenient. Blade sizes for me tend to range from 2/0 to 4/0 (probably my most used size) and 8/0 for cutting very fine wires for tiny jumprings.

    The blade switching mechanism makes it very easy to work on complex, multi-holed pieces, and the screw tensioning is particularly good for the finer blades I use for thinner sheet.

    However, I recently got a Green Lion to add to my collection, and I have to say I love it for basic cutting of sheet - it's a bit heavier than the KC, but the balance is lovely. My knackered old hands aren't up to using their suggested tensioning technique, so it's back to the bruised breastbone, but have found it a pleasure to use for thicker sheet (anything over about 0.8mm) and it's definitely a little more accurate (perhaps because of the slightly shorter usable blade area).

    As for blades, this is an ongoing debate - there's a long thread on here from a few years ago, and I don't things have changed much since then:

    https://www.cooksongold.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5907

    And just in case it helps, here's a useful chart to help decide which size blade you should be using:

    https://www.cooksongold.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1155

  5. #5
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    Here are some observations to fill in the gaps in what has already been said:

    A basic frame is fine, but some have levers instead of thumb nuts, which helps to tighten the clamps.
    Also it is worth having a slightly bigger throat (the distance between blade and frame), to cope with deeper sheets. About 5" improves your scope.

    It is quite common for very thin blades to slip in their clamps. Have a look for a small metal fragment lodged in there. Ultimately you might need a gentle tweak with pliers to hold thin blades securely.

    You need to experiment with the tension, as judged by the musical note when you pluck the blade. it should not twang but give a clear low note and a feint high note. what you need is half way between.

    Valorbe blades appear to be the brand leader, but I have problems with them breaking, so I favour Bergeon, from Cousins, or Walsh. Dennis.

  6. #6
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    That’s a good description of the blade sound Dennis, I couldn’t think how describe it

  7. #7
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    Grace, for decent piercing one of the first important things is a secure bench peg that is fitted at the correct height for you to see what you are piercing in comfort. The Knew Concept saw frames are good and easy to tighten saw blades, the ones with the lever tightener are useful as you can release the blade and re tighten it back to where you had originally tightened it in a few seconds, which is great when you are piercing many interior patterns. When I was taught to pierce I was told to hold the saw frame at right angles to my eye line and do most of my piercing across the bench peg, so that I could see where the front of the blade was cutting. I find the 5 inch deep KC frame a very useful size. As for saw blades, I use Glardon Vallorbe blades, sizes 6/0 to 1/0, the size I use depends on the thickness of metal I am piercing.

    It may be useful if you could post a photo of what you intend piercing.

    James

  8. #8
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    Feb 2019
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    Thanks so much to everyone for the detailed responses! This is such a helpful community! It’s very much appreciated.
    Having considered all the advice, I shall continue practicing piercing (with all the advice I’ve received) and give it a bit more time before committing to a new saw.

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