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Thread: Tube settings

  1. #1
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    Default Tube settings

    Hello
    Thought I'd start a new thread as I'm certain I'll need it!

    I'm starting two tube settings (first attempt). One for a 4.6mm faceted stone for which I have appropriate tube and burs now as advised by Dennis and Sarah.

    For the other I was hoping to set a weeny cab - 3mm. My idea was to use two bits of tubing in a telescoping fashion for this. I've bought the tube, one piece with external diameter 3mm, one piece with internal diameter 3mm. I know I'll have to measure a stone and buy one exactly the right size.

    I thought this was a good plan to make a nice secure seat and also because I like a thicker bezel (the outer tube is 0.5mm thick), but now I'm worried:

    Firstly the tubing doesn't telescope - it refuses to fit maybe a light sand will encourage it tho.

    Secondly now I'm worried the full width tube will be impossible to push and I should instead have planned to cut a seat in just one bit of tube with an upside down cone burr...

    What do folks think? Is my original telescope idea likely to work?

    Many thanks as always
    Faith
    Last edited by Faith; 13-09-2016 at 07:47 PM.

  2. #2
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    Default

    You're on the right track Faith, but tube sizes are not quite as described, so you will get into trouble fitting them.
    Next you are now dealing with sterling silver, a much harder animal than the fine silver you have been using. So pushing home even 0.3mm of rim can be tough.

    I suggest you start the seats with a round burr, using tubing no more than 0.6mm wider than the stone, and make the seat more perfect for cabs using these dedicated flat ended burrs to finish: https://www.hswalsh.com/product/frai...se-select-size.

    Of course being me I do it by hand. Dennis.

  3. #3
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    Thanks Dennis, why oh why didn't I ask before, the one size of tube I needed I didn't order then

    And I'd totally forgotten about the sterling part!

    Well I'll have a nice stock of tiny lengths of tube at least

    Ta again,
    Faith

  4. #4
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    Default

    Yes I bought some of those for seating round cabs, I tried originally using a round burr but of course they don't sit properly if you do that.
    Have you got a vernier? you really need one of you are going to do inset or tube set stones as the sizes given for both tubing and burrs and also stones are never exact so you need to individually measure everything first.
    Im not sure tube is annealed when you buy it so you may also need to carefully anneal before trying to set stones ( I haven't actually done any tube settings myself so Im guessing here!)
    And lastly if you are going to push over 0.5mm sterling then you may find you need a hammer handpiece but see how you get on

    Of course being me I don't do it by hand LOL

  5. #5
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    Thanks Sarah

    Yes I figured I'd need a flat ledge for cabs less they wriggle around so it's good to know you recommend those burrs too. I read an old thread where "upside down cone" burs were recommended also, but it was a while ago.

    I do have a vernier, it's funny I managed for ages without it and now I'm measuring everything in sight, very handy!

    I think possibly I'll give up on the telescope idea and burr my cab setting from a single tube also thus creating a thinner wall to cope with - loathe tho I am to pass up any reasons why I might need extra Foredom toys :p

    I have entertained myself a lot the last few days "Foredom window shopping" the only problem being I've almost convinced myself I want the micromotor instead, which in itself isnt unaffordable, just that pesky hammer handpiece becomes really quite a serious upgrade.

    Perhaps I'll take myself to Sutton before Xmas and have a play

    Thanks again
    Faith

  6. #6
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    Thats definitely a good idea- I would love to have a play with all the toys before buying!

  7. #7
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    An alternative is to use round nosed pliers, with one side ground slightly flat, to pinch the tube just above the girdle.

    This is particularly gentle on fragile pieces which would be difficult to support for hammering and will save you £££.

    It requires a new skill, but very little strength. See the stone set chains and wire work in my album.

    Has anyone ever agreed, or supported me on this? No, it has only been met with a loud silence. Dennis.

  8. #8
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    I use ball burrs (almost, see below) exclusively for tube settings and do not have (many) problems with wobbly stones. I only hand cut, the Pros are:

    1. No matter what angle you are cutting at they cut the same shape leaving a horizontal seat for the stone where the cut curves inwards
    2. Once you are cutting beyond the half way point you get straight sided walls, again regardless of cutting slightly off parallel
    3. They are never perfectly ball shaped, and often you can use this to advantage to slightly widen the cut
    4. With care, and by hand cutting they remain self centering in the tube and if slightly off centre, you can see and adjust your hand pressure slightly to re-centre before you reach the half way point.

    I see the Cons of any other (Wheel/Setting/Inverted Cone) burrs as:

    1. You have to cut perfectly parallel else the seat and therefore the stone will not be horizontal
    2. The width/diameter of the burr is the width of the cut, unless you adjust your horizontal pressure but then the cut is no longer round
    3. I'm sure there must be a 3 at least, but it's early morning! If I remember I'll edit later

    Occasionally, for faceted stones I will start with a ball burr to get the cut centred, test the stone fit, and finish with a setting burr if needed

    I agree with the above, 0.5 walls of Sterling Silver are hard to shift without hammer assistance regardless of how recently in the construction/finishing process the tube was last annealed, whether by hand or mechanical aid, especially in the smaller tube settings. I aim for no more than 0.3, and less for the smaller stone sizes.

    Dennis, my father and mother almost always used to set your way with pliers on both claw and small bezel settings, though with flat-faced 'snipe' nosed pliers rather than round ones. Perhaps it's time I re-visited the method?
    Last edited by Paul Kay; 14-09-2016 at 05:48 AM.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis View Post
    An alternative is to use round nosed pliers, with one side ground slightly flat, to pinch the tube just above the girdle.

    ...

    Has anyone ever agreed, or supported me on this? No, it has only been met with a loud silence. Dennis.
    Hmm. Haven't tried that with tubes, I only use a pusher or hammer set (for the thicker stuff).
    I do use pliers for claw settings quite often (snipe, parrot and some bizarre setting pliers that were a gift).

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Kay View Post
    I use ball burrs (almost, see below) exclusively for tube settings and do not have (many) problems with wobbly stones.
    Yup. For larger stuff (4+ mm) I usually cut the bearing with a scorper though; I find the larger burrs far more inclined to chatter.
    The other thing with ball burrs is they come in 0.1mm increments, while setting burrs are in 0.3mm increments. Bud burrs are quite a nice halfway house - you still need to be sure they're straight though.

  10. #10
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    Thanks Dennis, Paul and Peter,

    I'm certainly sold on the pro's of the ball burs, and maybe I need to just try it, but I still cant help thinking that for cabs I'd need to flatten the seat a bit at least to keep them steady.

    Re the plier technique - why round nose pliers? Instinctively I would have thought fairly wide flat faced jaws would be less likely to 'dent' the bezel edge and keep it smooth? I must admit my only experience of trying to use pliers to close claws was a disaster (plier bites to fingers, work piece flying across the kitchen, broken stone and ultimately broken pliers). It was a virtually impossible job mind, I didn't realise it at the time, but pushing home, short, work hardened, 1mm sterling claws was never gonna go well.

    I can see the logic tho, its a little bit like using one of those stake tools with the concave end, except a bit at a time.

    Thinner walls for sure I think as well - especially now I've reminded myself of the 'sterling claw disaster'!

    Many thanks again,
    Faith

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