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Thread: Newbie soldering problems....

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    25

    Default Newbie soldering problems....

    Hi!

    I'm VERY new to the whole concept of jewellery making, and finding the amount of stuff I need to learn is amazing!

    I'm trying to teach myself from books and YouTube etc. which started well, but I am well and truly stumped by soldering jump rings!

    I just can't seem to get it right. I'm using silver 8mm heavy jump rings. I've tried "easy" strip which I've cut tiny chunks from (after filing the end clean), and also "medium" paste. I'm filing the jump ring surfaces and then using fine every paper, not touching them afterwards, and closing them tight closed by twisting slightly sideways until I can't see any gaps.
    Fluxing with borax, then popping either a tiny piece of the strip on top or else a blob of paste. (Have also tried the paste on its own since it contains flux).
    Heating it gently with a soft flame, I see the flux dry and expand, then it appears to shrink back down again so I can see the ring more clearly again.
    Then one of two things happen.
    Either I get the solder to melt and flow, but it DOESN'T flow into the joint leaving the ring with a split.
    Or I seem to get a crust forming and it seems almost impossible to get the solder to melt properly, leaving the ring still with a split and a lump of solder (possibly melted slightly in to a ball shape), sat on top!

    It looks so easy on the YouTube videos, but I've now wasted around 20 jump rings and am getting nowhere!

    I tried a small butane gas soldering blowtorch but this has a very hot and fine flame so I then moved on to a larger butane torch that I use for firing silver metal clay. I can't really affordŁ120-150 for the fancy looking torches, and I was told that the little soldering one I bought should be fine for jump rings.

    Any idea what I'm doing wrong please?

    Thanks

  2. #2

    Default

    I'm fairly inexperienced too, but I'll try to help!


    I only use strip solder, (I have tried paste but couldn't get on with it). What I do is:

    Create the jump ring and make sure it is closed tightly.

    put a pallion of solder on my soldering block and lay the fluxed jump ring on top, so that the join is directly on the solder.

    Use a little torch and circle it around the jump ring until the whole thing is hot and you see the solder flow up through the join.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    England
    Posts
    1,902

    Default

    Hi Andy,

    It's not easy to explain in words. But here are a few ideas. Just file the jump ring solder surface, don't use emory paper. Then use a milky mix Borax and paint both surfaces before closing the jump ring. Gently heat the jump ring, clean the solder and cut a small piece, holding the solder in tweezers dip it into some milky borax, then place the solder on the inside section of the jump ring, it should stick if placed when the ring is still hot. Then play your torch flame onto the outside of the jump ring, opposite to where the solder is placed. When the ring temperature reaches solder flow the solder should flow through the ring joint. Remember that solder will always run towards the flame. A lot of newbies think that you have to play the flame onto the solder to make it run, when you do this the solder generally just balls up, the idea is to get the metal up to solder flow temperature. I hope this all makes sense.

    James

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Central London
    Posts
    8,845

    Default

    Hi Andy, all you need for soldering jumprings is a small re-fillable mini torch.

    If they are newly bought in, there is no need to do more than make sure they are well closed.This is done By moving the ends from side to side, using two pliers, one in each hand until you can't see a gap and they are well aligned.

    If you prize them open and shut them again, they will have a memory and open when heated. Also they will not be as round.

    Now if you just want to solder one on its own, place the solder pallion on your block and the fluxed joint on top. Then use quite a small flame to heat away from the joint until the solder flows by conduction. for this it is best to close the air hole a little for a softer flame.

    If you are adding a jump ring, say to a chain, hold it up a little with tweezers with the joint at the top. Flux and put the solder at the back, out of sight. Then with a slightly larger flame and the air hole open, sweep the jump ring tentatively until the flux has dried. Then linger more until the solder flows.The reason for the sharper flame is that the heat will dissipate more.

    Lastly it is a good idea to work in semi darkness, so that it becomes more obvious where you are directing your flame. Dennis.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Hand Held MiniTorch new.jpg  
    Last edited by Dennis; 07-07-2016 at 09:58 AM.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    25

    Default

    Thanks for your super speedy answers guys!

    Interestingly two of you mention a soldering block.

    I don't have one of those - at present I'm holding the ring in a pair of tweezers which in turn are held in the air using one of those "third hand" things - a heavy base with crocodile clip arms. Maybe that's part of the problem because I guess having it sat on or close to a soldering block means that there is heat retained/reflected in the block and the piece is more likely to heat evenly without hot and cold spots?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    England
    Posts
    1,902

    Default

    If you intend soldering jump rings on items another tip is to make and use soldering clamps like these. They can also be used for holding many other items in position when soldering, such as ear wires and hooks.

    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	9097 Click image for larger version. 

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    James

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    383

    Default

    Hi Andy,

    When you say you have a "small gas soldering torch" do you happen to mean one a bit like this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Gascat-Sold.../dp/B009VXJU6C ? if so - that was the type that I started out trying to use, and I never got any success with it for jewellery. I bought one like the picture Dennis put up (in fact I think it actually is that one) and its been fab.

    I do my jump rings the same way Dennis describes for chain except I pop the solder on the top back edge if that makes sense, which works for me, and heat roughly across the middle of the jump ring from side to side (you want both sides of the join to be the same temperature), so the solder gets sucked down and forwards when it flows.

    Also you have to be quite careful with paste in particular, in that if you heat it directly or for too long it doesn't do well, and turns into a little black lump that wont flow.

    Hope that helps
    Faith

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    383

    Default

    Hi again,

    You asked if not having a soldering block is part of the problem - I'm happy for the others (infinitely more experienced than I) to tell me I'm wrong, but I doubt that's the problem. You definitely need a soldering block if you want to try the approach of soldering the rings lying down on the block (or if you're supporting them in some way that means your torch is pointing down), but otherwise if you're holding the jump ring with tweezers then i wouldn't have thought having a block below would affect the heating. That said I do everything over a soldering block, but in case i drop something hot.

    Personally I'd also find it easier to just hold the jump ring with insulated tweezers in my hand, rather than in a third hand, and I grab them with the tweezers opposite the join so they draw heat away from both sides equally - but that might just be a crazy thing i do that makes no difference at all

    Faith

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    3,392

    Default

    If you are holding the ring in pliers or tweezers then they will be acting as a heat sink and taking the heat from your ring. Ideally you need a soldering block and you need to heat the ring and solder not just the solder to get it to melt into the joint as has already been said

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    25

    Default

    Thanks again for all the advice. I think it may possibly be the torch I'm using - it is indeed quite similar to the one you sent the link to Faith

    I do have a torch which is officially a chefs torch and looks similar to the one Dennis showed, I also have a propane torch with a small (ish) burner nozzle but it's quite cumbersome with a large handle and a long gas hose. I'll try the chefs one tomorrow.

    Fingers crossed......



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