Hallmarked Napkin Rings

[Anna Wales]

Some interesting points made. There is a difference between people making jewellery as a hobby albeit a serious hobby and as a commercial venture. Having run a business it would have been out of the question to make all the findings, chains etc. With many of my designs, I have always made the first one and then had them cast, given the time they take it would be too costly timewise to make each one and still be able to sell at a realistic price. I don't feel in any way that I just assemble things. I do also make one-offs and I feel that a balance can be found between the two and it also gives me a wide range of prices hopefully to suit all pockets!
I agree with you Pat about the craft fair side of things. I've only been to a few since coming back into the business and I'm amazed that some are allowed to attend as they have obviously just bought all the stock in.

[medusa]

I think even 'assembling' or compiling components can be tricky as well, and if you are making to sell, then sometimes ready made components can make the difference between something costing a sellable £200 or an unsellable £500 in terms of time. I'm thinking here of a project I'm working on which is going to use three dozen tiny bezel settings. I was initially thinking of making them by hand, but having made a few of them, I know that this project would take me several weeks actual work as opposed to the probably two weeks it will take me. Whilst I am strictly speaking an amateur because I have no training, the stuff I sell (including castings which I enamel) helps to pay my bills, as our only income is my student's bursary so I need to balance how much time I can spend making something with how much it will sell for.

That said, I totally agree with you about the sellers you see who slice up silver tube, grind the ends smooth, and then sell it as a 'handmade' ring for £150 at a craft fair.

[caroleallen]

If I do buy the tube rings, there is still skill involved in cutting them up, filing, polishing etc. I would be adding to them though by soldering things on, so I wouldn't feel bad about that. In the run up to Christmas I made from scratch and sold over 100 rings. I'm just trying to find a way to cut down on the time consuming bits, as I found it all very stressful. As someone else said, it's about trying to make a living.

[surfergirl]

A very interesting post on something I was wondering about myself just recently. I've made a pair of leafy, pierced earrings and have been thinking of getting them cast.

As well as earrings, I have other designs in mind where I would solder the cast components together to make bangles, necklaces and pendants. Some of the finished pieces like the bangle would be more time consuming to produce but in the case of the earrings, all I'd need to do after clean up would be to solder on an earpost and attach a (non-soldered) jumpring.

Could I still describe the earrings as 'handmade'?

How do others describe their cast pieces? Do you mention they are cast from your original master?

I too buy the ready made earring backs, tubing and clasps. In my mind, I have no problem with describing a basic ring made of wire with a tube set stone as handmade. Even though I've not made the wire, tube or stone myself, I've designed the piece, shaped the wire and soldered it into a ring, cut the seat for the stone and set it and have finished it to a high standard. Different from buying a stone and using one of those snap fit settings: http://www.palmermetals.co.uk/shop/s...-settings.html

[surfergirl]

And exactly wot Carole said

[medusa]

If I do buy the tube rings, there is still skill involved in cutting them up, filing, polishing etc. I would be adding to them though by soldering things on, so I wouldn't feel bad about that. In the run up to Christmas I made from scratch and sold over 100 rings. I'm just trying to find a way to cut down on the time consuming bits, as I found it all very stressful. As someone else said, it's about trying to make a living.

^^^^ this

A very interesting post on something I was wondering about myself just recently. I've made a pair of leafy, pierced earrings and have been thinking of getting them cast.

As well as earrings, I have other designs in mind where I would solder the cast components together to make bangles, necklaces and pendants. Some of the finished pieces like the bangle would be more time consuming to produce but in the case of the earrings, all I'd need to do after clean up would be to solder on an earpost and attach a (non-soldered) jumpring.

Could I still describe the earrings as 'handmade'?

How do others describe their cast pieces? Do you mention they are cast from your original master?

I too buy the ready made earring backs, tubing and clasps. In my mind, I have no problem with describing a basic ring made of wire with a tube set stone as handmade. Even though I've not made the wire, tube or stone myself, I've designed the piece, shaped the wire and soldered it into a ring, cut the seat for the stone and set it and have finished it to a high standard. Different from buying a stone and using one of those snap fit settings: http://www.palmermetals.co.uk/shop/s...-settings.html

An awful lot of my stuff is cast. When I get a bangle back from the caster it takes me at least a day to do a basic clean up and another day to get it to a stage where it is 'done'. I get one done at a time and have no issues about it as they couldn't actually be hand made in the first place, though the process of crating the pattern can take me a couple of days all told (excluding collecting the seaweed!). The other cast stuff I sell is purely to make a bit of extra cash. Same with the plectrums.

as far as making things like ear wires, I;ve tried it and they look cr@p. When I finally get my earrings ready to sell, I'll be buying decent quality ones from George.

[ShinyLauren]

A very interesting post on something I was wondering about myself just recently. I've made a pair of leafy, pierced earrings and have been thinking of getting them cast.

As well as earrings, I have other designs in mind where I would solder the cast components together to make bangles, necklaces and pendants. Some of the finished pieces like the bangle would be more time consuming to produce but in the case of the earrings, all I'd need to do after clean up would be to solder on an earpost and attach a (non-soldered) jumpring.

Could I still describe the earrings as 'handmade'?

How do others describe their cast pieces? Do you mention they are cast from your original master?

I too buy the ready made earring backs, tubing and clasps. In my mind, I have no problem with describing a basic ring made of wire with a tube set stone as handmade. Even though I've not made the wire, tube or stone myself, I've designed the piece, shaped the wire and soldered it into a ring, cut the seat for the stone and set it and have finished it to a high standard. Different from buying a stone and using one of those snap fit settings: http://www.palmermetals.co.uk/shop/s...-settings.html

I cast quite a lot of my stuff from either an original hand carved from wax, or pierced and carved from silver sheet. Making each thing completely from scratch would be far too time consuming. And silly.

When I put them up for sale on my website, I describe them as cast from my original hand made design, and hand finished by me.

When I use ring blanks, I would never just polish up a ring blank and sell it, there's always work done to it, bits soldered on, texture hammered in, stones set etc.

[Tabby66]

If I do buy the tube rings, there is still skill involved in cutting them up, filing, polishing etc. I would be adding to them though by soldering things on, so I wouldn't feel bad about that. In the run up to Christmas I made from scratch and sold over 100 rings. I'm just trying to find a way to cut down on the time consuming bits, as I found it all very stressful. As someone else said, it's about trying to make a living.

I think Carole has summed it up nicely.............

[Patstone]

What I am talking about isnt casting or buying in ring blanks to help in the production speed. I am talking about people that buy in ready made jewellery with snap in settings, that all they have to do is put a stone in it, job done and then call it handmade. Like the ones that Surfergirl (Indi ?) mentioned earlier. If they want to do that, they shouldnt call it handmade, we buy clasps, fine chains and obviously the stones, and we have a sign on our stand to say that everything is handmade by us apart from the fine chains and clasps. People buying from us know that we have hand crafted just about everything, and sometimes if people are interested we show them the sheet and wire that we make the stuff from. I am not knocking the hard working people who are trying to make a living from making jewellery, just the sharks that buy ready made, click a stone in and quadruple the price and still have the cheek to call it handmade.

[ps_bond]

I'm still playing devil's advocate I'm afraid Pat -

2 things:

1. How would you phrase that so it was unambiguous - so you can say "this does not count" and not have people like me say "ah, but what about..."?
2. If, for example, I'm asked to make a more complex setting (a basket-back cluster, for example) and the customer isn't happy to take the price hit that my fabricating it would cost, I then go to Eurofindings and buy an unfinished, standard pattern/size setting, solder it onto a shank, finish it and then do all the stone setting - not handmade? Also, if the customer can't actually tell the difference between the fabricated & the cast finding, what do they feel they're paying for?

I'm particularly interested in getting my wording straight on this - I've got a couple of comments on the recent exhibition that relate to this and I'd prefer to manage some phrasing that doesn't get people's backs up.