Copper with Sterling Silver

[Patstone]

Hi, I was a few days off exhibiting at a local craft fair, just the sort with a tent in a field, plenty of mud and wind as it was at the top of a field and I decided that I could do with a couple of bracelets that would be shiny and cheaper for the lowly paid Devon farmers wives. I made a chain with big silver rings held together with copper jumprings. I thought haha now I have a new tumbler I would put this piece together with a couple of my own bangles into the pot. When it came out the silver was brown, all of it, not just the new bit, so I put the bracelet in pickle overnight but only polishing would get the brown out. I was given some copper wire by an electrician friend, but I also bought a reel from either Cooksons or Palmers not sure which, so it may have been electric wire I used instead of the proper jewellery making copper. I thought that it was the chemicals in pickle that reacted with silver and copper. In the tumbler I had just pure soap flakes and water, nothing else. Any ideas would be appreciated please, cos its stumped me, cant find anything in any of the books about tumbling silver and copper. Thanks in advance

[caroleallen]

Strange. I've only ever had things turn black if I've left them in the tumbler too long and then I just put in clean water and soap and they come up shiny again. I wonder if your shot has gone rusty maybe?

[Patstone]

I wonder if it was in too long then, I put it in for about 4 hours, it definately isnt rusty as its taken out and dried off after nearly every tumble, mainly because I cant find things if they go to the bottom. Plus I get a lot of scum from the soap suds too - yuk!

[mizgeorge]

4 hours is by no means a long time - I regularly tumble mixed metals for 24 hours plus.

I've never had anything turn black, brown, or any other colour. What soap and shot are you using?

[Patstone]

Hello George, I used mixed shapes stainless steel shot with 3 tablespoons DP soapflakes that say on the side 100% soapflakes. I put in one bangle that was hallmarked silver that I bought in England from a famous high street jewellers. and the other one was from Mexico, which was from a main street jewellers and the shop salesman spoke perfect English and he said it was sterling silver, and it has the 925 mark on it, I have had it for years and worn it a lot so if it was plate I am sure I would know by now. It has a little abalone shell bit on the front. The other one that went in was the one that I made, which was 1mm medium hard silver wire, with copper jumprings. The only thing that is suspect is the origin of the copper, because I am not sure if its the bit from the electrician, or from the reel I bought from either Cooksons or Palmers (cant remember which). All of them needed cleaning with cleaner, the one I made was dark brown, and I thought in for a penny etc, so I put it in a weak solution of pickle overnight, and it was a slightly paler shade of brown in the morning, so it all had to be cleaned.

[caroleallen]

There's no chance there was anything made of iron in there somewhere is there? Iron in the pickle can plate silver with copper but I'm clutching at straws here.

[Patstone]

The stuff went black in the tumbler, I only put it in the pickle to see if it would make it clean. It was fresh water and soap in there too, I think that it must have been the copper. I used some copper from stripped out electrical wire to practice doing chainmaille as its cheaper, and then I bought a reel from Cooksons or Palmers so that was meant for jewellery. Perhaps the electrical wire had some sort of additive in it, its the only thing I can think of. I may put some of it in again with some scrap to see if it does it again, then try it with the copper from Cooksons or Palmers to see if it does it with both copper or just the one. Thanks for the ideas, I will let you know how I get on.

[Patstone]

Thats a relief, I will try the experiment I explained to Carole, see what happens. Watch this space.

[caroleallen]

Thats a relief, I will try the experiment I explained to Carole, see what happens. Watch this space.

I'd really rather you didn't try that experiment on me and anyway, I don't think I'd fit

[Dennis]

Pat, Copper gets a brown powdery deposit when heated, which I take to be copper oxide. If it is not completely removed in your pickle, it is possible that the shot then works this into the silver parts.

I Would suggest that you brush your piece well with a wet and soapy Jewellers' brass brush after pickling and then rinse. You might find that this is all the polishing it needs, but if you tumble after this with clean shot and clean soap, I should be surprised if you had any more trouble. Dennis.