Piercing - advice help please.

[Animalnutty]

Hi,

I have been doing piercing for some time so it's not just about practice - have put a picture of a recent piece. It's about 1.5cm x 3cm and 1mm thick. I don't know if I am using the wrong blade size (using 8/0) as getting into tiny corners, or my technique is wrong or combination or anything else. I think lighting is an issue as things are definitely worse since working in a darker room but working on sorting that with light recommendations given here.

I always need to spend quite a bit of time finishing up and not sure the best way to do that as my lines are wobbly as you can see. Have added a picture after finishing cutting and then after using emery paper and a little filing and polishing, though couldn't to much filing as there wasn't really room and obviously still room for improvement. So want to get the initial cut more accurate if possible and not sure what I am doing wrong. Sometimes I have cleaner lines than others.

I also don't know the best way to finish - I can't get into all the little areas well and don't know how to get a nice even high polish on those little crevices, can you?

Any tips would be much appreciated.

Karen

Sorry, not sure why pics went side on.

[china]

I am not a expert on piercing, still very much a beginner, "it's not just about practice" to that I would say practice makes perfect, getting into tiny corners is always a challenge,
My hands are not as steady as they used to be so I often need to spend more time in the clean up phase adjusting wobbly lines with tiny escapement files and just emery paper.
The white nylon brushes charged with Tripoli for you flexshaft are a good way to start the polishing as they are more aggressive than cotton or wool buffs

[Goldsmith]

Hi Karen, first I would suggest that for 1mm. thick silver I would use size 2/0 blades, not 8/0, and for finishing the inner point areas I would use some small needle files that are ground to give knife sharp cuts. I use small Barrette and Crossing files that I grind to create knife sharp edges that are perfect for finishing off any sharp inner pierced corners. Or you can sometimes use smaller piercing saw blades to tidy up any deep inner corners if a file is not possible.

James

[Animalnutty]

I am not a expert on piercing, still very much a beginner, "it's not just about practice" to that I would say practice makes perfect, getting into tiny corners is always a challenge,
My hands are not as steady as they used to be so I often need to spend more time in the clean up phase adjusting wobbly lines with tiny escapement files and just emery paper.
The white nylon brushes charged with Tripoli for you flexshaft are a good way to start the polishing as they are more aggressive than cotton or wool buffs

Thanks for your reply, When I said it's not just about practice, what I meant was I've had lots of practice at piercing so it is more than that, of course the more you do the better you get or that should be the case, but actually that's not working for me, so think there is more to it than that. Actually my lines are more wobbly than they used to be. I actually have hand tremors but oddly holding the saw steadies them a little, so can't really use that as an excuse for this particular exercise, but does bring it's challenges in other areas. I'll certainly be keeping up the practice though as really enjoy piercing. Good to know that emery paper is the way to go for that bit of clean up :)

[Animalnutty]

Hi Karen, first I would suggest that for 1mm. thick silver I would use size 2/0 blades, not 8/0, and for finishing the inner point areas I would use some small needle files that are ground to give knife sharp cuts. I use small Barrette and Crossing files that I grind to create knife sharp edges that are perfect for finishing off any sharp inner pierced corners. Or you can sometimes use smaller piercing saw blades to tidy up any deep inner corners if a file is not possible.

James

Hi James,

I wondered about the blades, will try as you suggest. Will try and see if I can get some smaller needle files. Sorry if this is a daft question but how would one go about grinding them down. Is there something I can attach to my dremel that would do the trick. Thanks very much.

[Sheen]

I just bought myself a vallorbe 16cm knife edge needle file cut 4 for getting into tight corners. It's much more pointed than a bog standard make of file. There was also an esapement file which was even finer but i didn't think i needed to go that far.

[Animalnutty]

Hi Sheen,

Thanks, that's really useful to know, was it from Cooksons? I might get one and see how I go and get the other if needed, as do quite a lot of pieces that are tough to get into on angles and corners.

[Sheen]

Hi Sheen,

Thanks, that's really useful to know, was it from Cooksons? I might get one and see how I go and get the other if needed, as do quite a lot of pieces that are tough to get into on angles and corners.

Yes. The escapement files are usually used by watchmakers i think, they are very fine and can break if used to enthusiastically. I've never used one myself.

[Dennis]

Before buying any more equipment, remember that you already have the smallest files available: your saw blades used in reverse.
Choose a suitable size and reverse it in your frame. Dennis.

[Animalnutty]

Before buying any more equipment, remember that you already have the smallest files available: your saw blades used in reverse.
Choose a suitable size and reverse it in your frame. Dennis.

Hi Dennis,

That's a really useful tip, thank you.

[Goldsmith]

Hi Karen,
I have not seen how you pierce,so forgive me if I am telling you something you already know. When I am piercing sharp internal angles, like those on your horse tail, I will first pierce into the shape right up to the inner point, then I retract the saw blade and return the blade in reverse so that I can pierce out from the narrow inner point along the other side of the design, this means that I didn't need to turn the saw blade at the point thus creating a sharper inner point and better piercing.
This is easier to demonstrate than to explain in words.

James

[pearlescence]

Polishing - get the just published book by Masterpolisher Stephen Goldsmith

[Animalnutty]

Hi Karen,
I have not seen how you pierce,so forgive me if I am telling you something you already know. When I am piercing sharp internal angles, like those on your horse tail, I will first pierce into the shape right up to the inner point, then I retract the saw blade and return the blade in reverse so that I can pierce out from the narrow inner point along the other side of the design, this means that I didn't need to turn the saw blade at the point thus creating a sharper inner point and better piercing.
This is easier to demonstrate than to explain in words.

James

Hi James,

Thank you. Not at all, grateful for any tips I can get - I did what I think you are describing on a little sunflower I did recently as was the only way I could see to get in between the petals as they were so close and actually did get a much neater finish, so not sure why I did not follow the same principal here, where I was actually turning the blade or going up the other side to neaten up if couldn't get into the corner. Will do that in future. Thanks,

Karen

[Animalnutty]

Polishing - get the just published book by Masterpolisher Stephen Goldsmith

Thank you, have just had a quick look and it's affordable too, so will order a copy straight away :)

[Sheen]

You probably know both these things but i thought it would be worth mentioning just in case. I take it you bench pin is flat for sawing and not slanted? Also make sure you are seated low enough infront of your pin. If i lean forward i can rest my chin on my pin. Being low to the pin makes a huge diferance. People also say to look ahead to where you are sawing. :)

[Animalnutty]

You probably know both these things but i thought it would be worth mentioning just in case. I take it you bench pin is flat for sawing and not slanted? Also make sure you are seated low enough infront of your pin. If i lean forward i can rest my chin on my pin. Being low to the pin makes a huge diferance. People also say to look ahead to where you are sawing. :)

Hi Sheen,

Thank you. I know about the bench peg, but am a little confused about the height thing, but often wondered if I was a little low. I am definitely higher than you have suggested though, however on reading through some threads on the forum I had thought maybe I was a little too low as read a thread where I thought (but may have misinterpreted or just plain read wrong) where James said it was important to look down on your work so you could see where you were cutting. Wondering if I have just read that wrong though!

[Sheen]

I would go with james' description. He's the expert. maybe he can talk a bit more about this if he's about :)

[Animalnutty]

Thanks, Will see if I can find the thread again and re read as may have made a mistake :)

Just had a look, and what he actually said was that one of the most important things was that the bench peg was fitted at the right height so you can see what you are piercing, I obviously interpreted that as needing to see more from above but that's not actually what he said!

[JewelleryByMandy]

Hi Sheen,

Thank you. I know about the bench peg, but am a little confused about the height thing, but often wondered if I was a little low. I am definitely higher than you have suggested though, however on reading through some threads on the forum I had thought maybe I was a little too low as read a thread where I thought (but may have misinterpreted or just plain read wrong) where James said it was important to look down on your work so you could see where you were cutting. Wondering if I have just read that wrong though!

I always find it better to be on the same level. I lower my chair right down. I think it helps with tensions in your body too.
Looking ahead of your work always helps as well. Might also look into some of these little files mentioned. X


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[Animalnutty]

I always find it better to be on the same level. I lower my chair right down. I think it helps with tensions in your body too.
Looking ahead of your work always helps as well. Might also look into some of these little files mentioned. X


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Thanks, I will definitely give being lower a go, it feels a bit counter intuitive, like I won't be able to see what I am doing properly but will certainly try. Thanks everyone for all the tips. Might give the same horse another go to see by comparison :)

[JewelleryByMandy]

Thanks, I will definitely give being lower a go, it feels a bit counter intuitive, like I won't be able to see what I am doing properly but will certainly try. Thanks everyone for all the tips. Might give the same horse another go to see by comparison :)

Love the horse btw.


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[Animalnutty]

Love the horse btw.


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Bless you, thank you very much.