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mrsekky
24-09-2009, 05:54 PM
Does anyone have any good recipies for patination of copper. I would also be interested to know any tips or advice on how to get the best effects.


Thanks.:)

Boo
24-09-2009, 06:22 PM
That possibly depends on what you mean by patina - the term gets used to mean slightly different things. Oxidising and antiquing are the way of making it look older, something I do a lot, but you can also bring out greens on the surface with acids usually and heat applied will give reds and blues and a rainbow of surface effects.

What are you trying to achieve?

mizgeorge
24-09-2009, 07:17 PM
There are a number of excellent copper patination recipes in Tim McCreight's Complete Metalsmith if you have it?

Atelier Ava
25-09-2009, 08:28 AM
The book The Jewellers Directory of Decorative Finishes by Jinks McGrath has a couple of pages on copper and brass patination. It really depends on what you want to achieve colour wise.
Paula

ps_bond
25-09-2009, 08:50 AM
Mare urine.

:D

The metal needs to be very clean before patinating; I usually use a horse hair brush and a pumice/water slurry to swirl over the metal to strip all remaining oxides before going on to patinating. For Japanese patination recipes, it's fairly common to cover the metal with finely grated daikon/mooli after the pumice as a sort of chemical pre-treatment.

MuranoSilver
25-09-2009, 11:06 AM
Hmm in the absence of a mare would a cat do? Would a Tom cat work
(imagines labelled patination sampler board =:-O)
Nic x

agent_44
25-09-2009, 11:08 AM
Hmmm, I'm thinking if there's a market I could bottle it and sell it!

Di Sandland
25-09-2009, 11:22 AM
Does the mare have to be the four-legged kind, or would the old bitch over the road do?

ps_bond
25-09-2009, 11:36 AM
Yes, cat works quite well - the sawdust patination method is particularly suited to soggy cat litter.

As for mares... Well, the 4 legged kind is what I had in mind, but I'm told human works too.

For the more timid, straightforward household ammonia is not too bad either :)

mrsekky
26-09-2009, 09:16 AM
Thanks for all the ideas.

I was hoping to acheive a green colour on my copper.

Have tried a mix of salt and vinegar which has worked quite well.

I have a rabbit so maybe I could slip a small copper item into his litter tray and see if it goes a funny colour!

I am going to try heating the copper to get a red colour when time permits.

Where can you get household ammonia from?

Claire.

Solunar Silver Studio
26-09-2009, 09:28 AM
The mind boggles!! Imagine trying to tell the story of that particular piece to a prospective customer!!!+o(

The thing about patination that bothers me is how do you keep it looking as good as it did the day it was created?? I know we did some heat treatments at college on copper and got some stunning results and then tried different ways of sealing it but it muted the colours terribly!! But then nobody knew what they were doing there...and I mean the tutors - not the students!! There was no metals expert of any king during our last year so we had to sort of make it up as we went along...:-O=:-O:'(

mrsekky
27-09-2009, 01:37 PM
I am only just starting to try different things with this but I have used plasti-kote fast dry enamel from B&Q today and at the moment it seems to work well.

Have only tried it over a green patination so will have to have a go over some other colours a see what happens.

Claire.

Emerald
27-09-2009, 02:25 PM
all you need to achieve red is to heat and then quench but there are othere ways to achieve a brighter red just dont know them and if you just put a watery mix of your borax cone on the metal this gives a good affect aswell

mrsekky
28-09-2009, 11:48 AM
Thanks,

Will have a go with heating my copper in different way and let you know how it goes. Am at college for my nightclass tonight so hopefully I should be able to have a serious go.

ps_bond
28-09-2009, 12:07 PM
Have you seen Ganoksin's content on patination?
Tips from the Jeweler's Bench Article Archive - Ganoksin (http://www.ganoksin.com/borisat/directory/library/subject/25/1)

Coco
07-10-2009, 09:41 AM
Have tried a mix of salt and vinegar which has worked quite well.





Interesting. Sounds do-able too i.e I already have everything right here and won't have to go running around town like a loon and accidentally buy a ton of chocolate instead #-o


What kind of salt and vinegar ratios are we talking?

mrsekky
25-10-2009, 09:25 AM
I used three table spoons of white wine vinegar and two teaspoons of sea salt. I then painted this onto my pieces twice a day allowing it to dry out before applying another coating. I did this over three days and got reasonable results.

I have coated this with a laquer spray to maintain the effect.

Athough the effect is a little patchy I think it adds to the rustic / natural effect I was trying to acheive and as you say it is great not to have to use any nasty and hard to find chemicals.:cool:


Claire.

Dano
27-10-2009, 11:17 AM
all you need to achieve red is to heat and then quench but there are othere ways to achieve a brighter red just dont know them and if you just put a watery mix of your borax cone on the metal this gives a good affect aswell

one of my lecturers told me that you can get a really good red on copper by heating it to a dull glow and applying beeswax while it's still warm, but i've never tried it, so caveat emptor

ps_bond
27-10-2009, 11:26 AM
By warm, I take it you mean warm to the touch, not still glowing?
Good way to fill a workshop with smoke otherwise...

Dano
27-10-2009, 11:38 AM
By warm, I take it you mean warm to the touch, not still glowing?
Good way to fill a workshop with smoke otherwise...

not to mention burned fingers =D yeah, human warm not metal warm :Y:

ps_bond
27-10-2009, 11:51 AM
That's probably just to protect the patina - you're trying for the rich red oxide.

Patina Formulas for Brass, Bronze and Copper (http://www.sciencecompany.com/patinas/patinaformulas.htm) has an interesting variety of recipes.

Di Sandland
27-10-2009, 11:55 AM
What a brilliant resource - thanks for that Peter