resizing - soldering with set stone in water

[kraftrourke]

I have a sterling silver with quartz ring that I've made about a half size to big. The size was perfect, but before setting the stone I stupidly double-checked the fit on a hot and humid day and stretched it. I set the stone and finished it only to find in normal weather it's too big. Lesson learned. Now I want to resize it with the stone in place.

I just removed 1.5mm on the band at the solder joint. I understand that if I secure it upside down, keeping the stone submerged in water, I can solder the band closed without messing with the stone. Hopefully that is true!

My question: What do people use to hold the water? Is a glass jar safe to use? Will that amount of heat be ok? What about ceramic? I have lots of little ceramic candle holders that are just a bit bigger than the stone. I also have a small aluminum box... :dontknow:

Are there other ways to go about this?

Thanks!

[Aurarius]

The last time I tried to resize a sterling ring with a quartz stone in situ, the stone discoloured and cracked. Bear in mind that silver is a better heat conductor than gold. Submerging the setting in wet sand or clay would be better than just water.
Can't you unset the stone before resizing?

[kraftrourke]

Thanks Aurarius! I was hoping avoid unsetting the stone. It's in a bezel that I closed by hammering. Also, I don't know how to open a bezel without ruining it (yet?)

My girlfriend works at a ceramic studio. I can get my hands on a few different kinds of clay. Would porcelain be good? I think it has the least amount of grittiness.

[china]

I use thermo gel

[BarryM]

I use Thermo Gel too - works really well and supports the piece for soldering, apart from the really burnt bits can be reused (keep in an air tight container)


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[LydiaNiz]

Another thermogel fan (but I might try using a masking-taped scalpel to open the bezel first).

[enigma]

You might be lucky and get it done with thermogel but equally it may ruin your stone, I would say it depends whether you want to risk that or not.
If I really didn't want to risk the stone I would remake the setting if need be after attempting to remove it without damage.

[Dennis]

Why not reconsider the whole approach. Hot and humid weather will recur and with it the same problem.

What you need is a means of reducing the size of a ring temporarily when it happens. Ring clips are ugly but highly effective in accommodating small changes. There are other ways too: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=tighten+finger+rings&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b&gfe_rd=cr&ei=XomNV4O4MemA8QfP-IbgDA

Dennis.

[Nick martin]

Thermogel works well for me, but as Enigma has said I'd also be tempted to remove the stone. In all likelihood you'll destroy the setting, but then simply remake it if possible.

Nick

[Patstone]

Why not just leave the back open. Smooth off the silver ends so they are rounded and hey presto it fits all year.

[kraftrourke]

Thanks everyone for your insights! I'm still on the fence with the difference options. I like the safe ideas - taking stone out and remaking bezel or turning the band into an adjustable. The large size and weight of the stone might be an issue for the latter. I'm leaning towards the more dangerous solution of soldering with stone in place, just for the experience. I will probably ruin the stone, but feel like I need to try.

Thermo Gel is tough to find in the US. Do either of these seem equivalent? Heat Shield (https://www.riogrande.com/Product/Heat-Shield-with-Syringe-Applicator/503039110) (rated to a higher temp, good reviews) or Chill Gel (https://www.riogrande.com/Product/Rio-Chil-Gel-with-Syringe-Applicator/502076) (has Gel in the name!)

In case the size of band vs bezel/stone has any bearing on successful heat control, here is the ring:
9151
Pardon the unfinished appearance.

[Nick martin]

If I were you I'd either email Betts Metals here in the UK about posting Thermogel over to the U.S. as the product costs peanuts anyway, so even with postage wont be astronmical.

Or get onto the RioGrande website and search for 'heat insultating paste' as I've just done. They do some version of the stuff.

Nick

[Dennis]

I have watched this thread for some time, but did not join in, because the replies have been so assured that I presume these members have no doubt about their success.

I am sure that either of the pastes from RioGrande would do, but regular users will have tried both and then find that they prefer one of them. My instinct is to go for the higher temperature one.

The real problem with soldering silver, is that it conducts heat away so fast, that all but an extremely hot flame might not allow the silver to flow. As you know, the normal procedure would be to heat the whole of the ring first, from some point remote and then home in on the joint.

The metal on this one is quite thin, so you might succeed. In the end you must just try it for yourself, but if you persevere for long enough because the solder is not flowing, then inevitably the stone will suffer.

Personally, I would unset the stone by inserting a pointy craft knife, gently and repeatedly round and round. Dennis.

[josef1]

Im with Dennis unset it. for smaller stuff I have seen a potato used as a heat sink ,smells nice aswell

[Goldsmith]

It may be easier to find someone to laser weld the shank together.

[enigma]

Ive never soldered with a quartz stone in but have done so with diamonds, sapphires and turquoise when they are small /cheap enough for me to do it out of interest to see what happens.
All stones behave differently depending on the stone and any treatments it has had and how much heat gets to it.
Personally I would just unset this as the setting is big enough that it would be quite easy and reasonably likely if you are careful to be able to be reset.
But for sure if you want to experiment let us know what quartz does when its heated lol