Diamond cutting on silver

[Janie]

Hi there, I am hoping someone can help me. I'm a newbie to jewellery making but I really want to be able to put the sparkly diamond cut onto my silver pieces as I love the way it looks. Does anyone know how I do this and what tools I will need? Desperately been searching online but found nothing to help me. Then I remembered I had joined this forum so I'm hoping all you experts can help me.... thank you in advance... Janie

[Dennis]

The best way to do this is probably learning hand engraving. However what you might be thinking about is diamond fly wheel cutters.

I have never been tempted to try them as they are eyewateringly expensive and need some skill if you are not going to break them at the first attempt.

http://www.goldschmiedebedarf.de/search.php?queryFromSuggest=&goldschmiedebedarf_en=channel&query=3655

Fishers warn you of this and suggest that you practice using a hard metal fly wheel first. My 2012 printed catalogue quotes 3655/U, but I can't find that on line.

Dennis.

[ajda]

It might depend on what you are making and what effects you are trying to achieve. Could you say more about the kind of pieces you might be working on and the kind of finish you want? Then maybe those with knowledge and expertise in specific areas will be better able to advise.

As I understand it, "diamond cut" chains are so called not because they are cut with diamond tools but because the links are ground/filed to form flat faces which catch the light and give a sparkly appearance like diamonds. On some things (generally in the process of forming them) you can get a similar sparkly effect by hammering - each little dint caused by a blow from the hammer makes a facet that catches the light. Then there are various ways of cutting and engraving, with hand tools and/or cutting wheels, which as Dennis suggests may need some investment in time/training/practice as well as equipment - there are several people on here who know what they're talking about in this area (and I'm not one of them).

Alan

[Goldsmith]

I am assuming that you actually mean cutting silver with bright cut facets similar to a diamond. If so this is a process achieved by cutting the facets with a polished face scorper, diamond setters also use this method when bright cutting around settings. I learnt this method when making regalia stars such as KCBs. These photos may explain better. They show my friend Don cutting diamond facets on a silver KCB star and also photos of one of my scorpers prepared for bright cutting.

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James

[Janie]

Hi Dennis... thank you for your reply. Ah... hand engraving is something I would love to be able to do! I understand it takes a very long time and practice but it's definitely an area which interests me ...much! I'll have a look at the fly wheel cutters you have suggested too as I haven't seen these before... Thank you so much!!! Janie.

[Janie]

Hi Alan, thanks so much for your reply... yes I think I have been calling it the wrong name and have just found out it is called 'bright cutting', quite by chance. I can't tell you how thrilled I am to even discover it's name after months of thinking it was called diamond cutting! I feel so relieved and humbled to finally know! I have tried hammering and love this too and think maybe I need to practice this more to get these facets that you talk about... and you are so right as it's the way the facets catch the light which I love so much. I cannot wait to get practicing now!!! I cannot thank you and Dennis enough for your time and such helpful advice... I wish I had posted this months ago as this is the best place to come and get great help and advice... thank you!!! Janie.

[Janie]

Hi James... OMG ... YES!!! this is exactly what I would love to be able to do!!! As I was saying to Alan, I quite by chance discovered the word 'bright cut' late last night whilst looking at another link and I cannot tell you how thrilled I am to discover the name of it after months of calling it 'diamond cut' Doh! The silver star is amazing! Thank you for showing me these pictures by the way. I have looked into hand engraving before and I've seen courses to be able to do it... one was in the States and the other was in Ireland... neare,r but I haven't found anywhere in the UK yet so if you know of anywhere I'd welcome any thoughts. Also the tools... I have bought one with a push handle but don't really know what I'm doing so if you could recommend a basic kit what I need to buy I would be really grateful!!! Do you think it's something I could teach myself with practice or would you recommend getting tuition? Just so that i'm clear... does bright cutting come under the umbrella of hand engraving in that it's one technique of hand engraving or is it a skill that stands alone?... THANK YOU in advance... Janie. ps... where do I get one of those polished face scorpers, I need one in my life!

[enigma]

In the Studio run engraving courses in Kegworth if thats any help.

[Patstone]

Presumably the sandbag cushion holds stuff still while you are engraving, I wondered how you stopped the work from sliding around. I have difficulty holding silver sheet still while piercing, I suppose my hands arent as strong as they were. I have tried using a clamp but it just marks the silver sheet, any ideas anyone.

[Goldsmith]

Hi Janie, you can buy flat scorpers from most jewel tool shops, I see Cookson only list small width flat scorpers / gravers, I would suggest you start with a 2mm. width flat scorper / graver like these; https://www.cousinsuk.com/product/graver-vallorbe-flat-edge , the £11 75 one 3rd from the bottom of the list is OK. you don't need HSS for cutting silver. You will also need a wooden handle for it, I use these; [url]http://www.cooksongold.com/Jewellery-Tools/Wooden-Handle-Shape-D-prcode-999-ALO[/url

I have all shapes and sizes of scorpers in my tool kit as I use them for many jobs such as carving, bright cutting, engraving and also for cleaning off bezel tops. The first sizes I bought were sizes 18 and 22. (2mm. and 2.5mm. approx widths)

This is a scorper preparation photo sheet that I prepared a while back, you might like to print it out for your records.

any other questions just ask.

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Good luck
James

[Goldsmith]

Presumably the sandbag cushion holds stuff still while you are engraving, I wondered how you stopped the work from sliding around. I have difficulty holding silver sheet still while piercing, I suppose my hands arent as strong as they were. I have tried using a clamp but it just marks the silver sheet, any ideas anyone.

Our hands do get weaker with age Pat, do you pierce on a standard width bench peg (70mm.) and is it secure? if so then you should not need a lot of strength holding sheet down when piercing, don't push the blade forward when piercing and the bench peg should hold the sheet steady as the blade pressure is on the down stroke. It is only shaped items that I find hard to hold while piercing these days.

James

[Patstone]

The benchpeg is part of my GRS system and is 70mm. It is the smaller items I have difficulty with. I try to avoid piercing if I can, when it comes to cutting out for instance a square to make a pendant with I normally use shears and then use two steel blocks with the silver sandwiched in between then hammer to make it flat. I have a Knew Concept saw too so there is no excuse, think finer blades may help too as most of the stuff I make is 1mm or thicker and I use a "0" blade or sometimes a "2".

[Goldsmith]

The benchpeg is part of my GRS system and is 70mm. It is the smaller items I have difficulty with. I try to avoid piercing if I can, when it comes to cutting out for instance a square to make a pendant with I normally use shears and then use two steel blocks with the silver sandwiched in between then hammer to make it flat. I have a Knew Concept saw too so there is no excuse, think finer blades may help too as most of the stuff I make is 1mm or thicker and I use a "0" blade or sometimes a "2".

I would use a 2/0 or 3/0 blades to pierce 1mm. sheet, I use "0" for 2mm. thick sheet. I have no experience of the GRS system, my bench peg fits tight into a slot under a brass plate on my bench.

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James

[Dennis]

Pat, obviously if your silver sheet can move around, blades will break like billyo. You might like to try this, but it still needs to be fixed=ed to your bench with screws or a strong clamp, or fitted into a slot. Dennis

https://www.etsy.com/uk/listing/191620833/jewelers-bench-pin-spring-loaded-jewelry?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=shopping_uk_en_gb_supplies-commercial-tool-low&utm_custom1=ebf6218c-f15b-4961-b08d-a7b5d4642f26&kpid=191620833engb

It clamps your sheet like a mouse trap and should at least assist your hands. (large picture, half way down). Dennis.

[jayneharrison]

I use them for many jobs... and also for cleaning off bezel tops.

Hi James,

I'm just starting to practice bezel settings and am intrigued by your comment - I wonder if you could elaborate please, or maybe show an example?

Jayne

[Goldsmith]

Hi James,

I'm just starting to practice bezel settings and am intrigued by your comment - I wonder if you could elaborate please, or maybe show an example?

Jayne

Hi Jayne, if the top edge of a bezel setting is a bit uneven after setting the stone, I will first file around the rubbed over edge and then use a scorper to cut around the top edge of the bezel wire to give an even finish, making sure not to mark the stone while doing this.

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James

[jayneharrison]

Ah, thank you James - it definitely does give a brilliant finish. I think I'll leave it a while before I let myself loose with a scorper though!

[Patstone]

The GRS system for the benchpeg is just a clamp that screws onto the edge of a bench and the benchpeg slots into it. It is quite a good system, as you can get various attachments. I have a type of vice, mainly for holding rings when stone setting, but there are lots of attachments you can get for it.

[Janie]

James... thank you so so much! For all the links for the tools, the photographs which I will definitely be referring to often... and for your generosity and time... when I looked at these kind of tools before I was so confused as to which ones I should purchase as there are so many, and all with differing names and measurements. Now with these fab links I will go ahead with confidence and get started, well I'll be having a little practice!!! I cannot wait. As a complete novice I cannot tell you how much these links mean to me, even after looking at these types of tools before and reading around the subject for weeks and months on and off, it's so nice to finally know what I will definitely need to get going. ... . I'm thrilled and so thankful to you and everyone else on this site as you are all so generous with your knowledge and skills and it's so refreshing to find. Kinda puts my faith back in humanity big time... THANK YOU once again!!! Huge amounts of appreciation... Janie

[enigma]

Hi Jayne, if the top edge of a bezel setting is a bit uneven after setting the stone, I will first file around the rubbed over edge and then use a scorper to cut around the top edge of the bezel wire to give an even finish, making sure not to mark the stone while doing this.

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James

I really struggle with that James, what shape scarper do you use?

[Goldsmith]

I really struggle with that James, what shape scarper do you use?

I used a 2mm. wide flat scorper / graver with a polished cutting face.I always harden and temper my scorpers after I have shaped them on a grindstone, after they are tempered and sharpened, I polish the cutting flat face by rubbing the scorper using emory paper held on a steel flat, finishing it with a 4-0 grade paper.

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James

[Janie]

Thank you so much Enigma... I'll look into it ...

[enigma]

Thank you so much James!