What torch?

[Kimkie]

After years of managing with one of those 'canister with a nozzle on top' torches, I am looking to buy myself a proper one. Can anyone recommend anything in particular? Suggestions would be appreciated, thank you :ta:

Kimkie

[Petal]

It all depends on what Jobs you'd like to do with it. I've got a larger torch, bought from B&Q for those jobs which require a bit more heat, plus a Nimrod for teeny tiny jobs with a very fine flame and a Lakeland torch for medium type stuff with a bushy flame. Then there's the torches which have a proper gas cannister involved and loads of other techy stuff. I'm sure other swill pop alone with their recommendations too....Good luck with whatever you decide to buy.

[Anna Wales]

My torch is similar to 999AKZ1 on Cooksons. It copes with all my soldering requirements. I've only ever used a Propane torch and the bottles seem to last forever.

[Patstone]

Yes mine is similar to Anna's, and the bottles do last forever. I also have a small one from Lakeland but that one seems to run out very quickly and the gas is quite expensive to buy. I tried the Poundshop, because they sell them but for some reason it doesnt seem to burn as well as the more expensive one, so better to pay a bit more.

[trialuser]

If you are considering buying the sievert torch shown in the link above, look here (http://www.tools4atthebench.com/product/sievert-pro-86-jewellers-gas-blow-torch-kit/)
I've got a smiths little torch hongkong knock off and I'm very happy with it, but it also requires a supply of Oxygen as well as fuel.

[Kimkie]

That's great, thanks folks. I have avoided having a tank of gas as my workshop isn't ideal, but I am finding I need a bit more oomph with some of my chunkier pieces.
I will probably go with the Sievert, but thank you for the help :-)

[Goldsmith]

For most work I use my Smiths Little torch, but as others have said this requires oxygen and propane. I also use the Sievert along with many of the different nozzles. My only gripe with the Sievert is the size of the actual torch, I like a small torch when soldering at the bench. The only other option that is rarely suggested these days, but something I used for many years before starting on oxy/gas, is a standard mouth blown torch, attached to a gas supply on low pressure and either blown by mouth or the air supply was powered by a small electric blower, like one of those blowers used on ink jet pens.

James

[mizgeorge]

If you don't want a large tank, consider an orca (much nicer balance than the horrid clunky Sievert) with a MAPP cannister. With an adapter, you can use the same torch with a full size propane tank as well. The balance is much nicer and it comes with a range of tips.

I have an embarrassingly large collection of torches, including two little torches, which I run with propane and an oxycon rather than tanked oxy, but my go-to torches are always my better hand torches, which are more than enough for pretty much every jewellery task other than casting. I love the freedom of not having any hoses and being able to put my torch down wherever I want as well as being able to move round a piece without dragging a vulnerable hose with me.

If you do really want a sievert, I think these are still the cheapest option - http://gasproducts.co.uk/acatalog/Sievert_Pro_86_Jewellers_Gas_Blow_Torch_Kit.html

[Wallace]

Like George, I have many torches, but have finally settled for my little smith and my aquaflame thingy.

My orca now sits lonely in a drawer as I no longer need to take visits up to my mum. Very portable, but now redundant for my set up. It has connectors for mapp and for the big standard gas bottle. It is a wonderful beastie, but space and limits mean the two I now use can only have smaller support. I have a little nimrod for those spot soldering moments or power failure.

The orca remains a favourite tool from the past.

[Kimkie]

That's all really helpful! Thank you.

I had forgotten about the tube dragging across the bench lark! Maybe I'll just stick with what I have :-)

[Jazzy]

Like George, I have many torches, but have finally settled for my little smith and my aquaflame thingy.

My orca now sits lonely in a drawer as I no longer need to take visits up to my mum. Very portable, but now redundant for my set up. It has connectors for mapp and for the big standard gas bottle. It is a wonderful beastie, but space and limits mean the two I now use can only have smaller support. I have a little nimrod for those spot soldering moments or power failure.

The orca remains a favourite tool from the past.
Hi Wallace

Could I ask if you would be interested in selling your orca and accessories

Thank you jazzy

[medusa]

If you are considering buying the sievert torch shown in the link above, look here (http://www.tools4atthebench.com/product/sievert-pro-86-jewellers-gas-blow-torch-kit/)
I've got a smiths little torch hongkong knock off and I'm very happy with it, but it also requires a supply of Oxygen as well as fuel.

I think mine is a knock off as well. I use mine with an oxycon, but dear lord, I have problems with it! I'm doing something wrong, I know, but I'm pretty sure the flame isn't supposed to be ~that~ little!

[Goldsmith]

I think mine is a knock off as well. I use mine with an oxycon, but dear lord, I have problems with it! I'm doing something wrong, I know, but I'm pretty sure the flame isn't supposed to be ~that~ little!

Hi Liz, My Lttle Torch is a very old model, I only use nozzle sizes 4/5/6/7. I thought I would take a few photos to give you an idea of what size the flames should be. The firebrick in the background is 9 inches long and I included a £1 coin as a size reference. My torch runs off propane and an oxy cylinder. the photos show each nozzle's flame size from my smallest, number 4 up to the largest I use number 7.

James

5030503150325033

[medusa]

thanks for that James.

I think I really need to get mine sorted because I get nothing like those kind of flames off mine. Nozzle 6 (which is the largest one I have) gives me something close to your first picture. Maybe it's the oxycon or the it's the fact that it's a knock-off.

When I get the next lot of work out of the way I'll try and get some vid of it in action.

[ps_bond]

I get about the same as James with my (gen, recent) Little Torch and an oxycon.

[trialuser]

Mine is definitely a fake (or a bargain, which I doubt!). It seems the knock offs are slightly less powerful than the genuine item for the same nozzle size.
These are pictures of mine with a number 5 nozzle set to about min and about max, there is loads of range within each nozzle size depending on the flow rate of the gasses.
This is O2 from an oxycon and fuel is propane, I have also used it from medical (100%) oxygen and it 'seemed' a bit hotter. I think Oxycons knock out low 90's%.
50345035

[medusa]

I get about the same as James with my (gen, recent) Little Torch and an oxycon.

go on. rub it in.

[ps_bond]

I think Oxycons knock out low 90's%.

The Devilbiss I bought from Tuffnells does 93% +/- 3% @ 1-5lpm according to the service manual.


go on. rub it in.

Sorry. Looked at the knock offs and came to the conclusion it was an area where "buy cheap, buy twice" held sway.

[susieq]

I often have problems soldering and truth be told I think the main problem is me, but it doesn't stop me from wishing that I had a torch with a bit more oomph.

For bangles, which is mostly what I (try to) make, I have, as Dennis has suggested in the past, built a little "oven", but with limited success especially when it comes to avoiding firescale. I manage to solder 3.2 x 1.6 mm wire but it takes several minutes, and I've never had any success getting solder to flow on wire larger than that, even with two handheld torches. (I have the cheapie cookies torch and a lakeland torch, although the latter, even though it's bigger than the cookies, doesn't seem to hold much gas and quickly runs out).

Mind you, I frequently have problems soldering jump rings - I can have a whole row of them and some solder easily and others remain stubbornly unsoldered and then I lose patience with them and spitefully turn them into little balls.

The little torch looks lovely - small, easy to use and lots of youtube tutorials where one needs only tight clean joints, flux, a few bits of solder, a little heat either side of the join, flux turns glassy and voi la - solder flows, no time for firescale and hardly any cleaning up to do. Obviously, I do all this already (with the exception of the solder flowing and no firescale) but iin any case, unless I spend the next year doing overtime then I can't justify the cost.

I've used a Sievert in class and although weight wasn't a problem, I did find it very difficult to see where the hot part of the flame was in relation to the bushy part, so whilst it was great for annealing I had just as much trouble with firescale when it came to soldering with it so I'm not sure it's an ideal next step up for me.

I'm leaning towards the Orca, but I've only ever seen it in a catalogue, never up close and personal. The cheapest option would be with a Mapp cannister, but I'm concerned that that will make it cumbersome (and heavy) to hold. Also, would hotter Mapp in my inexperienced hands be more of a liability than propane?

Hmmmm. Decisions, decisions. Hopefully Walsh's will have one I can manhandle at IJL.

Susie

[Dennis]

Hi Susie,

Don't hold you breath, I don't think Walshes will be there, and if they are, they haven't in the past had any gas on. Sutton tools have demonstrations, so they are a more likely bet.

You are right, bangles even of quite thin wire, need large torches to solder them efficiently. As I have mentioned before I often use two hand held Campingas torches together (one in each hand) to spread heat evenly. To get a more bushy flame, which is kinder to wire, I have made sliding brass clips, so that I can partially close the air holes. This has not been tested by Health and safety, but works for me.

As for jump rings, try laying them flat with each join exactly on a small pallion of solder. Then heat patiently and it will give you a high success rate. Regards, Dennis.

[ps_bond]

Don't hold you breath, I don't think Walshes will be there, and if they are, they haven't in the past had any gas on. Sutton tools have demonstrations, so they are a more likely bet.

Stands A141 and E148 respectively, according to the exhibitor list.

[medusa]

Mine is definitely a fake (or a bargain, which I doubt!). It seems the knock offs are slightly less powerful than the genuine item for the same nozzle size.
These are pictures of mine with a number 5 nozzle set to about min and about max, there is loads of range within each nozzle size depending on the flow rate of the gasses.
This is O2 from an oxycon and fuel is propane, I have also used it from medical (100%) oxygen and it 'seemed' a bit hotter. I think Oxycons knock out low 90's%.
50345035

that is definitely more than I get, but then I'm also using an oxycon.






Sorry. Looked at the knock offs and came to the conclusion it was an area where "buy cheap, buy twice" held sway.

in fairness to myself, I didn't know I was buying a fake, I thought I was just buying a small jeweller's torch.

[Dennis]

Stands A141 and E148 respectively, according to the exhibitor list.

Yes, you're right Peter, listed under H in my Essential Guide, which makes sense.

[caroleallen]

I think my Smiths torch is a knock-off as well. I do get quite a good flame with it though and when I went back to my Sievert the other day, I really stubbled with it

[caroleallen]

"stubbled"! :)

[susieq]

Stands A141 and E148 respectively, according to the exhibitor list.

I actually meant to type Suttons but my insomniac brain had my fingers type Walshs, so as Walsh are there that's a bonus. I'm just hoping to get a feel for the weight of it really although a Mapp cannister will alter the balance significantly.

Dennis - I do line up with small pallions underneath, but they sit there and taunt me. Maybe I need to heat a little more patiently. I have a free day tomorrow so will practice. A jump ring bangle sounds quite nice.

Susie

[Patstone]

Is that a Cornish expression then !!!!! Like grockles here in Devon and I think its Emmetts in Cornwall. Hahahaha



"stubbled"! :)

[caroleallen]

It's definitely a term that describes my OH!

[ps_bond]

Stubble burning is, thankfully, a thing of the past. Razor burn isn't, more's the pity.

[Patstone]

Oh!! that sort of stubble. In a previous life I was married to a farmer for 23 years, so know what stubble is, it didnt dawn on me doh!!!!


Stubble burning is, thankfully, a thing of the past. Razor burn isn't, more's the pity.

[mizgeorge]

Just on the question of the orca with mapp cannister - it uses a hose between the two, so you can safely clamp the cannister to the edge of a workbench with a large jubilee clip and run the hose from the top, which isn't heavy at all. It still has the slightly cumbersome feel of any hosed torch, but is much smaller and neater than the Sievert, and the balance is nicer.

[susieq]

Ahh, thanks George - I had imagined that the cannister fitted directly on to the torch! Hopefully I will get the chance to check one out at IJL and as my OH forgot our wedding anniversary a new torch is definitely going to be guilt free. Stubble burning and razor burn? Don't tempt me. Grrr.

[ShinyLauren]

If you're going to IJL, have a look and see if either Suttons or Walsh have one of these you can look at: http://www.hswalsh.com/product/roxy-torch-kit-ts120

I've been using mine for about three years now and I really like it. I only do jewellery two or three days per week, so if you're doing it full time it would work out too expensive to keep replacing the gas and oxygen bottles, but for me it's perfect. Not sure it would solder something massive though, even with the largest burner.