PDA

View Full Version : What I Have Learned About Filigree.



Dennis
16-07-2013, 08:31 AM
Here's another way to skin a rabbit, or in this case, mount a pearl.

Intending to make a fancy ring for a summer visitor, I sent off for a large black pearl, but when it arrived I could see that to show it off would require quite delicate metal work. So my mind turned to filigree which had been demonstrated to my weekly class a while back.

Filigree is traditional in several countries around the Mediterranean and also in Russia and South America. Usually it is passed down as a family secret, but my links to the videos below let several cats out of the bag.

Basically it is made out of very thin strip, by rolling or drawing plain or twisted wire which is turned into loose spirals, coaxed into shape and fitted tightly into a decorative frame. Soldering is done with filings of solder, or with pallions.

For forming of the delicate spirals short tweezers are used, or the turns can be made by inserting the tip of a three square needle file into the centre. Once soldered it is brushed vigorously in a bowl of brackish water, or a nearby pond with a brass brush. Elf an safety would have a fit.

This technique is much more difficult than it looks and would take months if not years of practice to achieve a really professional result.
Two of the more revealing videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcVhkq4nxo4. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLShQYztBHI

Pearl supplied by Pearlescense. Dennis.

trialuser
16-07-2013, 09:56 AM
I could watch stuff like that all day. They make it look so easy, and no fancy tools.

caroleallen
16-07-2013, 10:15 AM
Dennis, you've surpassed yourself. I'm not normally a fan of filigree but that is absolutely beautiful. I haven't had a chance to look at the video, but will do so later.

mizgeorge
16-07-2013, 10:50 AM
Like that a lot Dennis. I've done some traditional Norwegian filigree (and had a go at a bit of the Russian style) using powder solder. It all takes a very long time though....

Anna Wales
16-07-2013, 04:42 PM
Thanks for that link Dennis, as others have said I could watch things like that all day! I've got some very thin wire ordered by mistake so I think I will have a play.

ShinyLauren
16-07-2013, 06:16 PM
That's a beautiful ring Dennis.

I don't think I'd have the patience for filligree!

Dennis
16-07-2013, 08:48 PM
Tank you all for your kind comments. There are actually two links there, although I did not separate them well, both involving brackish water. So if you want to do filigree, first find your pond.

Dmitrii
17-07-2013, 12:58 PM
Good combination and the work looks neat. Not many people do filigree here in UK. I found that a magnet tumbler is the easiest way to polish filigree. How did you go with polishing yours?

Dennis
18-07-2013, 07:26 PM
[QUOTE=Dmitrii;57714 How did you go with polishing yours?[/QUOTE]

A wet and soapy brass brush, but no gold fish. Dennis.

pearlescence
20-07-2013, 07:57 AM
Glad that pearl found a happy home Dennis. Great and patient work

Dennis
20-07-2013, 09:13 PM
Thank you Wendy.

Patstone
21-07-2013, 06:10 AM
Just watched the video Dennis, one thing that I am envious about is his tweezers, I have looked for some like that for ages, I need something a bit more robust than the ones that cookies sell. Dont know where to get them, I have looked in medical websites, dentistry websites, even foundry websites but to no avail. Does anyone know where I can get some like it please.

Dennis
21-07-2013, 12:36 PM
Made my own for this project, Pat (the brass one). You can't heat brass, or it becomes horribly soft, so I cut it from 0.9mm sheet, doubled it over and squeezed it hard in a vice. Then I secured it with a nut and bolt and opened it by inserting a knife.

Being short and broad, it gave a little more pressure to the filigree whorls. Dennis.

Dennis
21-07-2013, 12:40 PM
Sorry, forgot the picture and you can't edit it in.

Patstone
21-07-2013, 06:58 PM
4957

This is the ones I was talking about. Any ideas please.

Wallace
21-07-2013, 10:14 PM
Not a lover of filigree, but very fond of your work Dennis and this piece included. Thank you for continuing to share your amazing creations and how you made them too.

caroleallen
22-07-2013, 07:39 AM
Just watched the videos. Amazing work. The first one seems to do everything with a wooden stump. What sort of wood do you think he uses?

I wish I could come to your classes Dennis, you seem to do something completely different every week.

Dennis
22-07-2013, 08:10 AM
Not a lover of filigree, but very fond of your work Dennis and this piece included. Thank you for continuing to share your amazing creations and how you made them too.

Thank you Wallace, It's my other hobby, so I'm more than pleased if anyone enjoys reading it. As for filigree, don't worry, its just a phase and I'm more of a bus than a tram.

Dennis
22-07-2013, 08:27 AM
Just watched the videos. Amazing work. The first one seems to do everything with a wooden stump. What sort of wood do you think he uses?I wish I could come to your classes Dennis, you seem to do something completely different every week.

Don't know about the wood, but I think it would get you an ASBO if you used it indoors.

I have been going to that weekly class at Morley College for nineteen years and the teachers, first Barbara Christie and then Helen Smith, have been very dynamic. The short summer courses are very varied too and there is a strong connection with Central St Martins. It's more of a club really but sooner or later they will want me to graduate.

It's been awfully hot in London. I hope you are all keeping cool. Dennis.

Patstone
22-07-2013, 08:34 AM
Am I being thick or is that you in the videos Dennis. If it is you the tweezers arent brass but some sort of steel by the looks of it. They look a bit like dividers, that sort of chunkyness.

Goldsmith
22-07-2013, 09:18 AM
Am I being thick or is that you in the videos Dennis. If it is you the tweezers arent brass but some sort of steel by the looks of it. They look a bit like dividers, that sort of chunkyness.

Check out some modelmakers sites Pat, I saw this set of 6 heavy duty tweezers for £6, cheap enough and useful for a few jobs, I am still using surgical tweezers that I bought from a model makers show. This is what I was referring to online, see; http://www.wonderlandmodels.com/products/toolzone-6-piece-heavy-duty-tweezer-set/

James

Dennis
22-07-2013, 12:21 PM
Am I being thick or is that you in the videos Dennis. If it is you the tweezers arent brass but some sort of steel by the looks of it. They look a bit like dividers, that sort of chunkyness.

No sorry Pat, those videos are from foreign parts, so I'm a bit puzzled. Perhaps James' suggestion will help you, especially since you can always re-shape them with a file. Dennis.

mizgeorge
22-07-2013, 01:01 PM
Pat, I don't know if it helps, but I have two pairs of favourite soldering tweezers. I use the regular titanium fine ones from cookies - http://www.cooksongold.com/Jewellery-Tools/Titanium-Tweezer-130mm-prcode-999-1261 - and also have a pair of these: http://www.mangobeads.co.uk/glass-and-tools/japanese-lampwork/bent-super-tungsten-tweezer, which are ridiculously expensive, but utterly wonderful to use.

Patstone
28-07-2013, 08:13 AM
The tweezers I am looking for are made of quite thick metal by the looks of it, I keep melting the points of mine as they are quite thin metal, I even wondered if the ones I want are more for welding than soldering.

Dennis
28-07-2013, 09:34 AM
My best tweezers are made of titanium; Cookson 9991261 (130mm) http://www.cooksongold.com/category_select.jsp?query=Titanium+Tweezer+130mm&queryFromSuggest=true.

Although they soften a bit if made red hot, they harden again when cold. If they go out of shape they are quickly adjusted with pliers.They are safe to use in pickle and solder won't stick to them. if you like them more solid you simply file them a bit shorter.

I use them routinely for soldering chain links. Second best are stainless steel ones which are a bit cheaper. Dennis.

Patstone
28-07-2013, 02:16 PM
Just put some in my basket ready for my next order.

mizgeorge
28-07-2013, 02:36 PM
I think I'm having a "can anybody actually hear me" moment...

ps_bond
28-07-2013, 02:43 PM
Yup, and I'm wondering about those tungsten tweezers for platinum use. I usually use Lindstrom tweezers for positioning solder pallions, but never get them hot.

Dennis
28-07-2013, 06:21 PM
I think I'm having a "can anybody actually hear me" moment...

Yes we are going round in ever decreasing circles, George. Just enjoy it.

Dennis
28-07-2013, 06:26 PM
Yup, and I'm wondering about those tungsten tweezers for platinum use. I usually use Lindstrom tweezers for positioning solder pallions, but never get them hot.

I never have used platinum, Peter, but I guess those referred to above will yield too much when heated. Euro mounts and findings have these: http://www.eurofindings.com/Product/11258/TTST-Steel-Tungsten-Alloy-Tweezers, which might be just the job. Dennis.

mizgeorge
28-07-2013, 08:43 PM
I have a feeling the two pairs are very similar in construction. The tungsten ones I use are designed to be held in a pretty hot flame for fairly extended periods of time. I have to say, they are my absolute favourites and were well worth the money.

ps_bond
28-07-2013, 10:00 PM
The ones I have look like cheap crosslock tweezers with tungsten rods bolted in the ends; they're good at heat, but the flex on them means they aren't as effective at clamping pieces as I'd like.
The problem with platinum - according to all the literature, I've no experience to back it up - is the contamination of the metal by pretty much every other metal. Like lead & silver, but with everything...
I've not hit that as yet, hence the "no experience to back it up" - I'm being fairly diligent in avoiding the possibility.

Dennis
28-07-2013, 11:20 PM
What about ceramic tips then Peter?

http://www.eurofindings.com/Results?q=tweezers

Patstone
29-07-2013, 05:58 AM
I can hear you Georgie, I have just ordered the ones from Cookies that you suggested.



I think I'm having a "can anybody actually hear me" moment...

Icarleug
11-09-2013, 09:32 AM
I asked the guy making the filigree ring, Guido Graeff, about his tweezers and he basically said he had ground down a pair of regular ones to the length and width he liked working with.

All in all there is a ton of nice information at his website: http://www.goldleim.de/index.html including how to make a tool for making nice border wires and a sort of brazing flux for fusing (good for fine silver and gold filigree) using burnt chrysocolla and water.

It is all in German though, and he is helpful if asked questions (but still answers in German, so understanding of the language or a handy translator is needed).

Still, it is a really nice site with tons of free information.

/Andreas

Dennis
11-09-2013, 12:59 PM
Thanks,I bookmarked it to view at leisure, when I can find my German Dictionary. As you will see above, I simply made my own tweezers from a bit of brass. Dennis.