Moving back....

[Gemsetterchris]

So, we are considering moving back to the UK ..maybe around Windsor/Henley area. I've made a few calls & work sounds optimistic or at least there is good interest.
Are we totally mad? We do seem to be stuck in a rut here in Finland & both places have pros & cons.
I'd like your opinions...

[caroleallen]

I don't know how the big jewellery shops are faring Chris. I think things are a bit dodgy in the gallery world. Things have been fine for me but my customers are mostly online. My advice would be to get your website up and running as an e-commerce site.

[Gemsetterchris]

I'm planning on sticking to a stone setting service rather than retailing anything, which I decided isn't my thing.

[Tabby66]

Not being funny Chris, but good stonesetters are like 'rocking horse.....', ..........as you would expect, like I am with my 'finished piece', you will be judged by the quality of your work....., I'd happily try you for setting work and very much recommend to colleagues if I was happy, in return, i'd expect you to identify your limitations (opals??), my poor setting set ups and thus reduce trashed work and broken stones.....a mutually beneficial working relationship??!!

I think you'll find plenty of work out there,....your intended location may reduce your availability for "aaagh I'm desparate" work...but that maybe to your advantage?!

[Gemsetterchris]

Working with jewellery makers is important..I get a lot of work that while adequately neat, could have been better & more efficient to do with a few tweaks to "optimize" things.
I've had hardened goldsmiths change their ways & they realised how much quicker & neater their work was completed.
Small adjustments can make a world of difference which benefits all involved with efficiency, cost & result.
Shame I can't get some work sent here despite the logistics being reasonable for not so urgent things...

[ps_bond]

Does that suggest that anyone working with stones in their jewellery should have learned basic stonesetting, even if they never intend to do it themselves?
Actually, there's a course idea - goes with my design for manufacturing kick in other areas - teaching people to design pieces that can be set. You'd need some pieces that were a complete pig as well to compare & contrast.

[Gemsetterchris]

Absolutely, even theoretical knowledge goes along way..also helps that I know goldsmithing & engraving theory ( reasonably well ) even if I never do it.
No point making things that are problematic, sure some jobs can be tricky but trying to create a silk purse from a pigs ear is costly.
A lot of work is made without taking all things into consideration or through lack of knowledge, which is why setting can be less than great & needlessly expensive timewise.
If goldsmiths & setters actually worked together rather than be traditionally complaining about each others faults things would be a lot easier :)

[medusa]

Working with jewellery makers is important..I get a lot of work that while adequately neat, could have been better & more efficient to do with a few tweaks to "optimize" things.
I've had hardened goldsmiths change their ways & they realised how much quicker & neater their work was completed.
Small adjustments can make a world of difference which benefits all involved with efficiency, cost & result.
Shame I can't get some work sent here despite the logistics being reasonable for not so urgent things...

maybe some examples of how not to send stuff in verses how to prep something for setting? I have deliberately not looked to set stones in my work because I know I'd make a mess of it and I assume that getting something professionally set would be to expensive to be worthwhile, but if I knew I could make the setting an easier job and thus less expensive, then I'd be really interested in using stones more.

[Gemsetterchris]

There is a fine line between good & bad work which is where theoretical knowledge comes in.
A lot of the problem is wrong size stones..job is do-able but could have been a lot quicker/easier & therefore neater & cheaper. Also damage to stones is reduced...
There will still be different standards of work but I believe that would be narrowed down with abit more "communication".

[Gemsetterchris]

Example: a lot of manfacturers work I do now needs adjusting first eg: widening/deepening channels..some models have shrunk from original plan during casting..all these could save time with a change of stone size..(which they won't do):banghead:
At least now with new models I'm asked my opinion which helps a lot.
All these jobs have to be at a set price, so if I have to "waste time" altering them first, it cuts down on my alloted setting time..leads to adequate result rather than what could have been great...
Or then the too small square rubover ruby that took half an hour to get neat, which could have been a 10 minute job..small things like this are all do-able but not optimized for efficiency.

[ShinyLauren]

Have you thought about doing some stone setting teaching Chris?

I recently had three days of one to one tuition with a lovely jeweller and stone setter and it was an absolutely game changer with how I now make stuff and set stones. I'm now confident setting simple stones, but anything more complicated than a tube set/rex/v-claw or the one where you set it into the metal that I've forgotten the name of I'd happily send out to be set. But knowing how to set properly (I just taught myself previously. Really badly) had made me think a lot more about the design of pieces.

Anyway, the reason I suggest it is that it took me forever to find someone that would teach me what I wanted to learn, rather than booking a stone setting course that was more prescribed. I found the ones offered tended to be either basic - making a rubover mount etc, or advanced - pave/channel setting, neither of which is what I was after. So, I ended up doing a three hour train journey and taking four days off work to get the tuition I was after. It was absolutely worth the time and money though, and he's booked up pretty solidly, so might be something to think about?

[mizgeorge]

I'd agree with Lauren - I'd love the opportunity to do some ad hoc private tuition rather than take a defined course.

[Gemsetterchris]

Yes I have thought of that & It's worth considering.

[Tabby66]

Absolutely, even theoretical knowledge goes along way..also helps that I know goldsmithing & engraving theory ( reasonably well ) even if I never do it.
No point making things that are problematic, sure some jobs can be tricky but trying to create a silk purse from a pigs ear is costly.
A lot of work is made without taking all things into consideration or through lack of knowledge, which is why setting can be less than great & needlessly expensive timewise.
If goldsmiths & setters actually worked together rather than be traditionally complaining about each others faults things would be a lot easier :)

I guess that was my point exactly.....I have some theoretical knowledge and practical experience of setting stones.

However, what I also realise with the jewellery trade is you can become a jack of all trades and a master of none!! I enjoy and spend my time making pieces, model making and diamond setting skills,........mainly for bespoke, one off stones, this is what I wish to master and where I think my time is best spent.....(from both a business and personal perspective),........therefore, I think that I'm better paying a person who has mastered setting skills to set a stone well and in a fraction of the time I could. However, appreciating the stone-setters skills, I know I can learn from them and I expect the odd knock back of settings. NOT frequent Peter, (I hope!!), I have a good relationship with my setter and I ask if I think it's close and he advises if he thinks it's a no-go. Occassionally it's a tweak, sometimes it's a remake, often it's less than 0.1mm that makes all the difference.......

Chris, stone-setting courses are a definate option in the UK, access to skilled workmanship and teaching can be very limited. 1-2-1 or very small group.....I also think, as Peter has suggested that a, 'setting up your setting.......what the setter needs to make your setting more successful'...would be a great small group course!!

Best wishes
Tabby xx

[Wallace]

Chris, you both should come home, it is a nice place to be. We would be happy to visit and inundate you with needs for learning, setting and general good banter. :D

[Gemsetterchris]

Chris, you both should come home, it is a nice place to be. We would be happy to visit and inundate you with needs for learning, setting and general good banter. :D

That's kind of what we miss!

[Gemsetterchris]

How would a small theory discussion group work? With me working under a scope, a hands on lesson might be tricky, but I could explain my theoretics with a drawing board to a group that can split the cost.

[ps_bond]

Funnily enough, I'm partway through organising something like that for the ACJ Wessex group - it'll only be a shortish presentation, but all I've been asked for is a drawing board.

[Wallace]

How would a small theory discussion group work? With me working under a scope, a hands on lesson might be tricky, but I could explain my theoretics with a drawing board to a group that can split the cost.

you could always get one of those little camera doobry thingies that will show peeps what you are doing and put the edited short clips onto a large screen as you go through the theory. Seeing what is said in action with some help to focus the attention is invaluable. :)

[metalsmith]

Try a USB microscope .. of course you can pay several hundred pounds, but www .dabs.com/products/veho-vms-004-discovery-deluxe-400x-usb-microscope-65CS.html costs about £40 and has 20 - 400x magnification. The local primary school had something similar, which I poured scorn on until I saw the results. I'm sure this would be a worthwhile investment that you could cover the costs on your first tutorial session. Just to state I have no interests in this product or supplier.

[Tabby66]

I think that sounds great Chris, it would be really interesting to see and understand more!!

[Gemsetterchris]

Seems like lots of options available, thanks for the ideas, let's see how things go with the moving decision.