Tube setting cabochons

[silken]

Hi everyone!

This has been an ongoing issue for me and a leading cause of frustration in my little studio so I thought I should finally ask and see what other people suggest. I love tube setting and often set faceted stones with no problems at all. However, cabochons are slightly more pesky as they like to spin/overturn in the setting once the seat has been cut making it rather difficult to set them. I usually cut the seat with a ball burr then finish with a setting bur but the cabs hardly ever co-operate. I have resorted to cutting a level seat with whatever burr/sharp tool I can get my hands on (I don't have any gravers, I know, I'm terrible) but I'd love to hear if anyone else has any methods for tube setting cabs. I'm off to the jewellery quarter in the morning to visit cousins, cookies, sutton tools, the usual and I was thinking about getting some plain cylinder burrs to try out as I'm sure if I start cutting a seat with a ball burr then finish with the cylinder burr, I might just get a nice level seat.

Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated :)

[ps_bond]

If you want to cut a flat bearing/bezel shelf, can I suggest the use of a small inverted cone burr? Unlike a cylinder burr, it won't try and cut the full length of the bezel wall at the same time as the shelf.

[Goldsmith]

Hi Emily, I don't know what size cabs you are setting. I prepared this set of photos a while back to show my method of making a tube setting for large cabs. You can use this process on smaller tube settings and use jump rings as the stone seat.

James

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[Dennis]

You have my sympathy Emily, I am well aware that small cabs will suddenly turn turtle in tubes, if you can't control them with a fingernail and the only remedy is to have a good flat seat instead of the sloping ones for faceted stones.

Peter's idea will rectify this, but some suppliers such as Walsh sell burrs specially for this (Walsh FIG 4120) As with all expensive burrs, it saves on wear if you start with a ball burr first and then use the special burr by hand in a pin vice with a drop of oil.

With small stones or on unsupported areas I also like to pinch the tube at least to begin with, using round/round or round/flat pliers, which quickly captures the stone. Dennis.

[silken]

Thanks so much for the replies! James, those photos are wonderful! Thanks so much for posting. I usually use fairly thick walled tubing and cut the seat with ball/setting burrs so this technique would be great for setting the larger cabs that I usually just bezel set.

The cabs I most often tube set are small, varying from 3mm - 5mm but I do have difficulty trying to get them to sit down and behave! Anything above that size I usually just make my own bezels but James' pics have inspired me to start tube setting larger cabs!

Peter, that's a great idea! I didn't even think of using inverted cone burrs, all I had in mind was the cylinder burrs but thinking about it the cone burrs should be much more efficient. Dennis, I think I'm being stupid as usual but I can't find that reference anywhere on Walsh's website. Do you have a link to them at all? I didn't go to the jewellery quarter today after all (long story, involving someone trying to steal my car and having to deal with the police for most of the day) but I'm going tomorrow so if I can see what I need to look for that would be wonderful.

I really do appreciate all your help :D

[Goldsmith]

Emily, Cookson sells the inverted burrs, see; http://www.cooksongold.com/Jewellery-Tools/Burrbusch-2-Inverted-2.1mm-prcode-980-090

The way I showed of making stone seats works well for large diameter facetted stones also. These are a few of my daughter's silver bezel set rings, the facetted stone is a lab grown 12mm. diam. pink sapphire, the others are blue lace agates.
James

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[silken]

Wow, those rings are beautiful. I really love the pink sapphire one, the setting is perfect for the stone. You have a very lucky daughter!

I have quite a few burrs that I buy in sets from Rio Grande but sadly no inverted cones so I shall definitely pick some up tomorrow. I was just wondering what the specialised ones from Walsh's that Dennis suggested might be like. Either way, the cone burrs seem like they would do the job perfectly.

Thanks again for all your help!

[Dennis]

Dennis, I think I'm being stupid as usual but I can't find that reference anywhere on Walsh's website :D

Well, the website is not a lot of fun, so I was quoting from the printed catalogue. anyhow, here it is:http://www.hswalsh.com/Fraizer-.aspx?i=TF41210&c=1203.

These burrs come in various sizes to match you cabs. Sorry you had a bad day, Regards, Dennis.

[silken]

Ahhh! I thought it might be those. I don't have a copy of the catalogue so I have to resort to their somewhat difficult to navigate website. I'm going to get a couple of inverted cone burrs and a couple of those ones and see how it goes. I'm excited that I may soon be able to set cabs without the aforementioned hassle!

Thanks for your kind words, Dennis. It hasn't been the best of days but I'm hoping to cheer myself up by getting some nice new tools tomorrow. I asked my boyfriend for some tools instead of flowers this valentines day and he just sighed and gave me a strange look...a nice new set of burrs lasts much longer than a bunch of flowers, right? ;)

[ShinyLauren]

Emily, I asked for some wire cutters and a takeaway from Nandos for Valentines!

I use the inverted cone burrs for cabs as well - I set really tiny ones, like 2mm, upwards and they cut a lovely flat seat for the stone to sit on.

[ps_bond]

Takeaway??? Pah. I'm doing prawn & crab ravioli, beef wellington with Lyonnaise potates and millefeuille tonight. OK, I'm cheating by using bought pastry...

My go-to inverted cone burr is usually a 1.2mm FWIW. Great for cutting bearing shelves when flush-setting fancies in particular.

[Tabby66]

Emily,
If you go into Walshes in person, they are just so helpful,........and you are quite right..........burrs will last oodles longer than flwers ;)

Peter......*shocked*...........did I read that right.......BOUGHT pastry??!!..............I thought you handmade everything!!

[silken]

Gosh, Mrs Bond is one lucky lady! I didn't get a romantic meal, just a 3 hour visit from the police regarding the aforementioned incident...I feel very felt out! However, I did manage to get some wonderful new tools. I popped in to all the usual places, Walshes, Cousins, Cookies, etc. I bought myself one of the inverted cone burrs, a couple of the cylinder type ones that Dennis suggested and some other new goodies.

Tabby, give me a bunch of burrs over a bunch of flowers any day. Power tools over perfume too. Although, I did get a beautiful single rose as my OH thought it would be bad form to just buy me tools for V-day ;)

Mmmmmm Nando's...I'm a sucker for flame grilled chicken, halloumi and macho peas but I do a mean home made macho pea recipe *drools*

[ps_bond]

Peter......*shocked*...........did I read that right.......BOUGHT pastry??!!..............I thought you handmade everything!!

3 horses, 1 lorry ramp under repair, full time work and the jewellery - I've been able to justify to myself cheating like that.


Gosh, Mrs Bond is one lucky lady! I didn't get a romantic meal, just a 3 hour visit from the police regarding the aforementioned incident...I feel very felt out!

....

Mmmmmm Nando's...I'm a sucker for flame grilled chicken, halloumi and macho peas but I do a mean home made macho pea recipe *drools*

Yeah, not much fun by comparison. Neither the incident nor the followup.
Hmm. I wouldn't mind seeing your recipe, please?

[ShinyLauren]

I arrived home late from work last night to a valentines card informing me that whilst I was reading it he was out foraging for Nando's :) I am nothing if not a cheap date!

Please share the macho peas recipe - I love those!

[silken]

For anyone interested in the macho peas recipe, here it is (sorry, mostly improvised quantities but I judge it by taste). The OH loves them and even as a pea despiser I actually enjoy them!

Ingredients:
Frozen peas (depending on how many you're feeding, I usually put in about 500g)
3 tbsp roughly chopped fresh parsley
2 tbsp finely chopped fresh garden mint (mint sauce will do as an alternative but it is very vinegary so fresh is better)
2 tbsp butter/margarine
1 or 2 cloves of minced garlic
Crushed fresh or powdered red chilli to taste (I'm a wimp so only put a little bit in)
Salt and pepper (to taste)

The actual recipe is simple. Boil all your peas until they are tender. Drain the peas and separate about 1/3 to 1/4 of the peas into a separate bowl and put aside. Keep the rest of the peas in the pan (removed from the hob) and add the butter. Use a potato masher to mash the peas into a mushy consistency, the butter should melt into the mash but if it doesn't, heat the pan lightly until it does. You could use an immersion blender if you don't fancy the manual mashing! Throw in the parsley, mint, garlic and chilli and mash/mix it all in. Add some salt and pepper and taste the mix to test. At this point, you can add more herbs, chilli or seasoning if you like. When everything is mixed together into a nice smooth pea mash, take the rest of the peas that you put aside and mix them into the mash with a spoon. When everything is combined, garnish with a little more parsley and serve with grilled halloumi, grilled chicken or anything else that takes your fancy. You can omit any of the ingredients (other than the peas) and still great results.

Now, because this is a jewellery forum and not a cooking one, I feel that I should at least say that I will be playing with my new tools today ;)

[Tabby66]

3 horses, 1 lorry ramp under repair, full time work and the jewellery - I've been able to justify to myself cheating like that.

...............well, so long as you can justify it to yourself Peter ;p

My 'romantic' valentines evening got spoilt by traffic jam on the M6.......deciding that NO-ONE (other than-according to daughter - saddo singles/ or those who are past it??) would be going to Ikea on valentine's evening, my darling hubby, thought it would be a helpful 'treat' to take me.......since I need a few bits n pieces for a forthcoming show......I mustered the courage and resolve to go.......only to travel 3 junctions, static, exit M6, static, eventually completed circuit of island to re-enter M6 and head home..........romance is not dead in this household!!!!!!!!!

[silken]

I'm lucky to live just around the corner (well, 5 minutes) from Ikea and don't have to get on the M6 which is pure bliss. Mmmm their Swedish meatballs and lingon berry jam are lovely, not to mention the cinnamon buns. Why can I not get food out of my head?!

Also, I think I'm missing some posts. Are the forum gremlins doing their rounds again?

[SilverBouillon]

James,
Thank you very much for posting cab setting tutorial! I've been searching for that everywhere.

[silken]

Just a quick update...well, I bought some new burrs last week. I added a couple of different inverted cone, cylinder and wheel burrs to my collection and WOW I cannot even start to say how useful they are. Where were they all the time I'd been trying to tube set those pesky little cabs? I mainly use the inverted cone burrs and they cut perfect little flat seats for my cabs, no more wibbly wobbly frustration. I've managed to make several pairs of earrings and a couple of rings with minimal hassle.

Thanks to everyone that helped/gave advice. You're all wonderful and have quite possibly prevented several things being smashed/hammered to pieces by reducing my tube setting rage ;)

[Gemsetterchris]

You could also grind off the bottom of ball burrs..then you have a nice flat bottom burr that's useful for opening cab settings.

Sent from my HTC Desire S using Tapatalk 2

[silken]

Chris, I have so many old ball burrs strewn around my studio, why didn't I think of that? You're wonderful! Thanks for the tip :D

[Patstone]

Will this work for doing the setting on pointed back stones as well, I have difficulty using the bearing cutter as I cant see it well enough to see if its straight especially with the smaller stones.



If you want to cut a flat bearing/bezel shelf, can I suggest the use of a small inverted cone burr? Unlike a cylinder burr, it won't try and cut the full length of the bezel wall at the same time as the shelf.

[Gemsetterchris]

Pointy back stones, if your tube setting you only need a ball burr.


Sent from my HTC Desire S using Tapatalk 2

[Patstone]

I was told that the stone made an audible "click" when it was set properly and the only way that would happen was if you used a rim inside, or am I getting it mixed up with flush setting. I have never been taught, just picked things up from people, mostly on this forum. The only lessons I have ever had was at an evening school for one evening a week for ten weeks, and learnt how to solder and do bezel setting cabs, and I am afraid that is all. I am sorry for using "pointy back stones" but I dont know how else to describe them.
What do I need for flush setting then please, I have setting burrs, ball burrs, and cutting burrs in most of the sizes that I use.

[Gemsetterchris]

You can call stones pointy backed if you like or then faceted.
There is not alot of difference between tube & flush setting apart from one has a "wall" to work over & the other a "flat" surface.
Stones making a click noise require a "bearing" or rim inside..& that noise means the stone fitted nice & snug in the hole (that does not mean it is set), but it may appear so..

There is no right or wrong way to do things, i use both methods on both styles..whichever i think might be easiest or best in the situation at hand.

Sounds like you have all you need for flush setting, the only other thing is some kind of burnisher.. use brass if your worried about scuffing stones.
Getting a hole just right & a rim cut just right for a tight fit without stone damage is abit tricky but practice is the only way forward.

Some kind of magnification helps! You`ll manage, just shout if you need abit more help.

[Patstone]

Thanks you are a star. I have magnification and plenty of light on the subject, my problem is that I only have one eye and you lose the "how far away things are" judgement. Lost it four years ago in a cataract op that went wrong so still getting used to trying to judge distance. I am doing quite well now, but trying to line up the rim inside so that it is cut straight is a bit trying, and I wondered if there was an easier way of doing it. The idea of using a tapered cylinder burr looked interesting at least it would be straight so the stone wont be at a jaunty angle. Faceted is the word I was looking for, thanks again, terminology is something I struggle with, which I suppose comes in time talking to you guys, sometimes its like reading a foreign language.

[Gemsetterchris]

Wow, well done for persevering =D> , must be quite a challenge for you.
I tend to use a really small bearing cutter compared to the hole, holding the work at an angle to concentrate cutting a "quarter way around" at a time until the cuts meet.
You can go over it again deeper if needed, but i find it helps keep the "levelness" abit better.

[Wallace]

I tend to use a really small bearing cutter compared to the hole, holding the work at an angle to concentrate cutting a "quarter way around" at a time until the cuts meet.
You can go over it again deeper if needed, but i find it helps keep the "levelness" abit better. me too, thought I was being naughty and aquiring bad habits. :dance: lol But it certainly works :D *-:)

[Gemsetterchris]

Maybe we are..It's the result that counts not how you get there (with the exception of glue)!
Of course, learning a proper method(s) first is best, after that you can "bend" the rules abit to suit you.

Sent from my HTC Desire S using Tapatalk 2

[Patstone]

You would have been proud of me Wallace if you had seen the ring I made, not for the finish on it but what I managed to do with tinsy wincy stones, tube set into the ends of 1.50mm wire. Actually drilled out the wire, and set the stone into the drill hole. Just to think that only a few months ago I was struggling with 5mm stones, because they seemed so small at the time, now 1mm diamonds are the thing to use. Lol.


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Not very good at loading pictures, I hope its the right one !!!!!

[silken]

You would have been proud of me Wallace if you had seen the ring I made, not for the finish on it but what I managed to do with tinsy wincy stones, tube set into the ends of 1.50mm wire. Actually drilled out the wire, and set the stone into the drill hole. Just to think that only a few months ago I was struggling with 5mm stones, because they seemed so small at the time, now 1mm diamonds are the thing to use. Lol.


4451
Not very good at loading pictures, I hope its the right one !!!!!

Gosh, very intricate work! It looks lovely :)

[Patstone]

Its not bragging about doing a ring with small stones, its quite a milestone for me from celebrating the 4th anniversary of losing an eye in a cataract op that went wrong and bumping into doors etc, that I thought were further away than they were, and pouring a kettle of water onto the worktop instead of in the mug etc., to learning how to make silver jewellery and setting little stones like this. For me its a massive achievement. Sorry dont mean to sound sorry for myself, but there are some very clever people on this site that are probably thinking what a twerp, what is she banging on about, but for me 4 years ago, it was something I wouldnt have even considered possible.

P.S **** happens, so get on with it attitude!!!!


Gosh, very intricate work! It looks lovely :)

[silken]

I totally understand what you mean, it really is an achievement. I have slightly different problems but I know how difficult it can be trying to deal with a health/physical problems, it really does feel amazing when you achieve something. Your ring really does look lovely. Even for someone with perfect vision, it is not an easy task trying to set tiny stones in the end of wire! You have every reason to be proud of yourself :D

I have some teeny tiny (0.8mm - 1.4mm) beautiful spessartites that I'm going to try and tackle today. I've set quite a few tiny diamonds before but never garnet so it'll be a challenge.

[Dennis]

Actually, I've just dropped a 6.0mm cabochon Pat and spent half an hour looking for it. Could you come round and find it for me?

[trialuser]

Talking about dropping things - everytime I drop something I instinctively bend forward to pick it up and find the bench peg impaled in my forehead - every time!!! - how long will it take till I learn.

[Patstone]

I keep a very strong torch beside my desk as it butts up against a wall under a window, and if you drop a tiny diamond or clear stone, on a pale Dijon coloured carpet, unless it lands with the shiny side towards you, you dont stand a chance. If I lose something I am afraid its down onto all fours, and if I cant find it - call daughter, or sit down with a coffee and have another look later. Its not that I am proud of doing that ring, because the finish could be improved quite a lot, its the fact that I can, "how well" is beside the point.

[eirish]

I keep a very strong torch beside my desk as it butts up against a wall under a window, and if you drop a tiny diamond or clear stone, on a pale Dijon coloured carpet, unless it lands with the shiny side towards you, you dont stand a chance.
I bought this (http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/40225502/) black flat-weave cotton rug from Ikea to protect the carpet in my rented flat from bit of hot metal, but I've found that it also makes little dropped bits of silver etc. much easier to spot. All except that half jump-ring that jumped out of the tweezers last week, which I don't expect to find ever!

[Patstone]

I would be afraid that the black may seep into the carpet, I bought a red once once and that left a red mark on a pale vinyl floor, so I may be inclined to put something between the black and the carpet if I were you.


I bought this (http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/40225502/) black flat-weave cotton rug from Ikea to protect the carpet in my rented flat from bit of hot metal, but I've found that it also makes little dropped bits of silver etc. much easier to spot. All except that half jump-ring that jumped out of the tweezers last week, which I don't expect to find ever!

[caroleallen]

Respect. My eyes aren't that good and I struggle with tiny stones. I do have 2 of them though (eyes that is), so I fully appreciate how much more difficult it is for you Pat.

[Patstone]

I thought you meant you had two stones. Hahahaha. Its new things that struggle with, last week my mum who is 95 asked me if I would like a cuppa, so I went to the kitchen to make a cup of tea for us all, and my dad was telling me that they had bought a new kettle as the other one was leaking, so I poured water all over the worktop because the spout poured a wider splurge of water and of course I missed the mug a bit. Doesnt matter really but a bit frustrating at times. I am just grateful for my strong will, because the doc wanted to do the other eye first, and I insisted that he did the other one, now at least I have one eye that had a cataract op which is perfect. If it had been the other way around I certainly wouldnt be able to see at all by now. As mum says who at her age does all her own cleaning and gardening with dad helping in the kitchen says to me, "be grateful for what you have, there are a lot of people worse off" which is quite true. It hasnt really altered what I can do, just it takes me a little longer sometimes. A bonus is that I learnt to make jewellery as my daughter said why didnt I come with her to the evening class, and a moment of gung-ho I accepted. Now a lifetime of trying to find small diamonds on the floor on all fours with a torch. Lol.

[eirish]

I would be afraid that the black may seep into the carpet, I bought a red once once and that left a red mark on a pale vinyl floor, so I may be inclined to put something between the black and the carpet if I were you.

Oh dear, that hadn't occurred to me. I'll find some rug underlay for it. Thanks!

[silken]

I'm so grateful for the advice every one gave in this thread. Now, I can set cabochons with ease. I just thought I'd post a quick picture of the rose cut prasiolite cabs I set the other day. They're just simple tube set earrings. I love the pale minty green colour of prasiolite.

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[taylordebs]

Drooling!!! They are stunning lol!

[Dennis]

You're a dab hand Emily.

[Gemsetterchris]

Great job.! Very neat & tidy.

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[silken]

Thank you! :D

By no means perfect but I'm still happy with my cab tube setting efforts.

[Wallace]

Thank you! :D

By no means perfect but I'm still happy with my cab tube setting efforts. they look pretty damn hot - wtg Emily :D=D>