Newbie needing some advice re learning about silver

[palo]

Hi,

I am newbie to this forum and want to work with silver. I have done some jewellery making for the past 4 years but very amateur hobbyist I would say. i had booked onto a 1 year silversmithing course in Birmingham, but got chucked off after the first enrolment session because i explained I have certain challenges when it comes to dealing with things. The medical condition I have, which I won't bore you with, means that I have to manage myself very carefully and do risk losing muscle control at times, however this is never without warning and I generally manage it very well, after 13 years I have had a fair bit of practice, as you can imagine.

Now if silversmithing is too dangerous for me, is precious metal clay a feasible option. This is something I have wanted to do for a number of years, and frankly I was gutted when I was asked to not to attend, I know this is not beyond me and I have frankly dealt with far bigger challenges, could anyone suggest any precious metal clay books or silversmithing books to get me started, and perhaps in the future I can look at my budget again and see if I can afford a non adult education course where they may be prepared to teach me!

Thank you, sorry for the long opening post, I am not normally so garrulous, but felt I had to explain.

Sorry to clarify my requirements, I do have weaker hands and arms than probably normal people so heavy and standard size tools are not really very good for me, although I find the travel size or mini sizes ideal and easy to work with.

[Kwant]

Hi Palo, sorry to hear your plans were scuppered. From what you have said, the metal clays, would present very few problems for you as the tools can be lightweight, with little or no need for cutting or drilling. Torch firing may present you with difficulties as the temperature needs to be steady and consistent, but this could easily be overcome with the use of a kiln, any small soldering applications could be done at your own pace after firing.


In the first instance search youtube for metal clay tutorials there are many and this will show you how easy it can be for you, there are lots of books featured in Amazon but I caanot recommend one as I have not read any, someone else will be along soon no doubt to recommend one. Best wishes in your endeavours.

Excuse errors in this post I am on holiday and using an ipad which I loathe :0)

[josef1]

Have you thought about Cad design ? I know its not the same as making it with your hands but the result can be very pleasing you can download free trials of software from the web which have a certain number of saves and there is loads of tutorials etc on youtube to get you going

[Dennis]

Recent events have shown that determined people can do almost anything. However the main hazard for you seems to be around naked flames and red hot objects.

So you should be thinking of kiln firing your clay and having a decent heat resistant area in case you drop hot metal and cause a fire. I'm sure you can do it, so strength to your arm. Dennis.

[palo]

Thank you for the suggestions so far, I am a bit dubious about utube videos, I have found that for the own field of expertise they are dominated by Americans whose legislation differs from our own, and the their tools and techniques are not necessarily ones we use in the UK, of course I don't know the situation with silver or PMC, which is why I was hoping for more specific suggestions.

I am a bit perplexed by the CAD idea, I thought that was just design not actually making anything or learning about properties or utility etc?

I am quite capable of using tools and do use them extensively, I am extremely risk averse and do ensure that safety is a priority with whatever I do and never work when I am unable to function.

Does the torch firing have to be applied for long periods, that I would not be able to sustain, but if it is for say 10-15 mins that would be ok, and does it have to be hand held or are there not tools that can assist?

Sorry it is hard to try to understand something when I am so ignorant! My jewellery making book (Jinks) arrived today I hope to be better informed after reading that.

Again thank you for your help.

[Toni]

I was hoping for more specific suggestions.
What sort of specifics are you after?
if you are planning on selling you would need to insure that it is sent to an Assay office for hallmarking, (unless under certain weight) this means you can sell it legally stating it is silver...

I am a bit perplexed by the CAD idea, I thought that was just design not actually making anything or learning about properties or utility etc?
CAD would just be design, but you could send the designs to people, or design for people, good money in that. you could also create designs per peoples ideas, certain things need to be/are best created by machines, e.g when using wax.


Does the torch firing have to be applied for long periods, that I would not be able to sustain, but if it is for say 10-15 mins that would be ok, and does it have to be hand held or are there not tools that can assist?
when torching PMC its best not to keep the flame in the same place, esspecially if the item is large, you would have to move it over the item to keep the heart consistance over the whole piece...Although expensive kilns are a good substitute.

hope this helps

[palo]

Ok, I have now watched a couple of videos, and read through Jinks, it looks considerably easier than I was thinking. The torch firing does not seem to be for very long, and therefore well within my capabilities, (certainly for small pieces) The kiln unfortunately is beyond my budget but I will consider long term.

My aims are just small peices of jewellery - earrings, pendants, brooches and mainly findings. I can't really manage/manipulate wire heavier than 18 guage or 1mm so wouldn't make anything heavier than that. I'm not fussed about that because that just rules out rings, bangles etc etc.

To me the creative process must involve making something out of raw material so I wouldn't be satisifed just with the design part of the process, the challenge is to turn your ideas into a physical creation that is what I enjoy and want to master. I am slow at that but I like to work to the highest standards and don't expect to turn out anything worthwile for at least a couple of years, but that is ok, skills aren't mastered overnight, and they take a lifetime to perfect.

I think I will start with PMC as the easier option and when happy with that look at silversmithing again - it was 12 years ago that I first thought about doing this, so I can be patient and wait for the right time.

Thank you for your help.

[Toni]

i love your attitude, so positive :)

You could buy blank rings and add to them, so dont rule out rings, plus you can make rings from PMC too, using a mandrele let it dry on that and then fire it...

[Dennis]

Just an added word of caution then: You are not exactly a beginner and you might already have a suitable torch, but mini-torches beloved of beginners can become dangerously overheated if used for prolonged periods, so a suitable torch will be a consideration.

If you put What Torch into our search box above you will find some of our recent conversations about this. Dennis.

[snow_imp]

If you have a gas hob in the house, then you can use that for firing precious metal clay (silver version anyway) too as long as the pieces involved are smallish (I was told smaller than a 50p and about as thick maximum) - it's the method I've used myself. For torch or gas hob firing you need a wire mesh anyway so either method is available once you have that - I think most starter kits for clay include one anyway. The advantage of using the gas hob is you can leave it as long as you need to (just keep an eye on it) but the downside is it will increase your gas bill slightly. :D

[medusa]

Coming from a background in disability studies, I'm horrified that you got thrown off your course. It's illegal for one thing.

[palo]

How does that apply in adult eduation, I understand the protection one has as an employee I didn't know that there was anything in terms of being a student?

I like the gas stove idea, hubby asked why I couldn't use that and I didn't know. Am busy doing a lot of reading an watching videos!

[snow_imp]

I used this site http://www.metalclay.co.uk/pages/Learn-more.html to find out about using the stove and I got some of my basic tools from them too - I think I bought a starter pack which included mesh/tools etc.

[Tabby66]

Hi Palo,
As Toni has suggested, don't discount making rings, it is possible to buy the blanks and then add your own work and design to it! Good luck with the precious metal clay or whatever you decide to pursue!! Let us know what you're up to :)

[silken]

Wow, I can't believe they kicked you off. Obviously I don't know exactly what your medical problems are but if there is a will, there is a way! I am from a medical/laboratory background and got into silversmithing a few years ago as a hobby but I have started to do it more as a profession now. I have physical condition that can effect me quite severely but I can tell you now, making jewellery is more therapeutic with regards to my condition than the medication that's meant to control it! There are many times you will need to use a great deal of manual dexterity & apply strength but there are ways to get around it. First of all, I work mainly on small pieces and the soldering time is minimal. I have the torch in my hand for maybe a minute, depending on the complexity of the piece. I cannot honestly see why you would not be able to do it. My honest advice would be to invest in some basic equipment and try it for yourself. I am entirely self taught, mainly through books and the internet, and the learning process is very liberating. Don't think that just because the course wouldn't accept you that you can't do it. You can!

It strikes me as discriminatory to dismiss you from the course because of your problem. Employers and education providers have an obligation to make their services accessible to people with physical or mental disabilities and can break the law if they don't provide equal opportunities but I am not 100% sure of the law surrounding this. Either way, please don't let it hold you back :)

[medusa]

How does that apply in adult eduation, I understand the protection one has as an employee I didn't know that there was anything in terms of being a student?


it's discriminatory. doesn't matter if you are an employee, student or customer, they can't boot you off a course unless they can clearly demonstrate that you would be a danger to yourself or others and that reasonable accommodation would not be possible. If you know when you are going to lose muscle control, I don't see what the issue is beyond the fact that they'd need to let you have frequent breaks and give you more time to complete projects. I taught at degree level until last year and if we had chucked a student off a course on the grounds of impairment we'd have been sued and quite rightly so.

[palo]

Well they can't clearly demonstrate it, however it can be sudden and unstoppable, in 13 years since being diagnosed I have fallen over a few times, but have never hurt myself or others. I do have some warning but I can't always warn others (also lose ability to speak and worst case eyes close over too). I always try to manage myself to minimise this happening when I am out and don't go out when I am at risk.

However I can only fight so many battles at a time, and I don't know if I want to take this on, I kinda feel if the teacher doesn't want me it is his loss and to his discredit. i also have the local authority wanting to double the primary school I live next too, increasing traffic choas and parking/ access problems outside my house and am slowly recovering from my latest relapse (which has been very taxing) and continues to provide many challenges.

I had been really looking forward to this as something to motivate and inspire me at a difficult time, so it is a blow, I know how therapeutic something like this can be and enables one to forget the little things in life, maybe when things are quieter I will look into this again and how to challenge this and move this forward. In the meantime I will see what I can do at home.

Thank you very much for your advice and support.

[Kwant]

I am sure you will do many things at home once you find your feet, I have only been making jewellery for two years and frankly considering I am self taught ( bar the help I have found on this forum and, youtube and trial and error) I think I have done rather well, and you will too :0)

[medusa]

Well they can't clearly demonstrate it, however it can be sudden and unstoppable, in 13 years since being diagnosed I have fallen over a few times, but have never hurt myself or others. I do have some warning but I can't always warn others (also lose ability to speak and worst case eyes close over too). I always try to manage myself to minimise this happening when I am out and don't go out when I am at risk.

However I can only fight so many battles at a time, and I don't know if I want to take this on, I kinda feel if the teacher doesn't want me it is his loss and to his discredit. i also have the local authority wanting to double the primary school I live next too, increasing traffic choas and parking/ access problems outside my house and am slowly recovering from my latest relapse (which has been very taxing) and continues to provide many challenges.

I had been really looking forward to this as something to motivate and inspire me at a difficult time, so it is a blow, I know how therapeutic something like this can be and enables one to forget the little things in life, maybe when things are quieter I will look into this again and how to challenge this and move this forward. In the meantime I will see what I can do at home.

Thank you very much for your advice and support.

uh huh, well with all the victimisation of disabled people going on with ATOS not to mention the way it has spilled into the media and public, it's wise to pick your battles, or, to use spoon theory, save some spoons up.

Like Kwant says, you can learn much from books, youtube and forums, so that is a good way to get started. The book I used first off was the tim creighton (spelling?) one. very basic but good clear pictures and explanations. I'm planning on getting the anastasia young one next, when i have more time to play in the workshop.

[Di Sandland]

Palo, I have an incurable and painful disease that flares and and recedes too. It does not sound so dramatic as your own problems but it is severe and limiting. However, it is not as limiting as other people would like to believe. I can, and do, lots of things. There are times, like right now, when I simply can't work in the workshop and I feel quite bereft, I would rather experience these feeling of loss, however, than sit moping around and not do anything. My time in the workshop is, as you say, so therapeutic and it takes my mind of the concerns associated with my condition. And now I've even found something to fill the non-workshop hours - I knit! I am very lucky because lots of people with my diagnosis lose the use of their hands, either temporarily or permanently, whereas I'm very lucky and can still do quite fine things with mine - mainly it's my legs that are the problem and, of course, I knit sitting down!

I understand why you don't want to take on a fight at the moment. For me, however, kicking against the pricks that would do me down is also very therapeutic!

I wish you well - go for it!