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Gemma
30-04-2010, 01:49 PM
Anyone know what I did wrong here or got any good tips on bezel setting?

1914

(And yes I realise its not just the setting that's a mess. I just couldn't be bothered to polish until after I seen if I could set the garnet)

geti-titanium
30-04-2010, 10:14 PM
Crikey! I think you might be using the wrong size chisel to set that.

caroleallen
30-04-2010, 10:21 PM
Crikey! I think you might be using the wrong size chisel to set that.

pms!

Seriously, have you tried working around it with a burnisher?

geti-titanium
30-04-2010, 10:30 PM
pms!

Seriously, have you tried working around it with a burnisher?

I think it might be too late for a burnisher Carole!

mizgeorge
30-04-2010, 10:55 PM
It's not great Gemma. However, you haven't set yourself an easy task if it's your first go at bezel setting.

Start with a slightly larger cab - and make it a smooth domed rather than faceted one as well. I think your measurements may have been off both on the size (it looks like the bezel may have been a bit too large), and on the depth - you need only a very small amount to rub over successfully - generally about a third of the total height of the cab is fine. I don't know what you've used as a pusher, but it looks like it might have been rather too small as well.

I can't see what's going on at the base though - have you tried to set the bezel into something else, or is it soldered flat onto a backing sheet? Lastly, it looks like there's a split at about 4 o'clock. Your bezel strip really does need to be perfect in both size and height before you start rubbing it over. And tight enough for the cab to 'snap' into it.

What tutorial did you use?

geti-titanium
30-04-2010, 10:57 PM
it looks like there's a split at about 4 o'clock.

It looks like there might have been a spliff at 4 o'clock to me :-)

MuranoSilver
01-05-2010, 12:59 AM
Geti - Don't be rude. This is a thread asking for advice & everyone starts somewhere.
Gemma - I can see what you were trying to do and Georges advice is all good. :Y:
On a positive note you can probably ease the stone out and start again
(you might even be able to save the setting by filing the top down a bit)

A flat backed smooth domed cab would definately be an easier start
Nic

mizgeorge
01-05-2010, 03:09 PM
That's your knuckes rapped Geti ;)

Actually, I thought it was very funny - and tbh I might not have posted at all if I hadn't been amused. I'm sure Gemma took it in the lighthearted spirit it was intended.

Di Sandland
01-05-2010, 03:33 PM
Do you know, if that had been me I would have been far more hurt by the deafening silence. That silence spoke a thousand words, not one of us willing or able to say what needed to be said. Geti's response hit just the right note - it wasn't malicious in any sense and, as George said up there, it served to break the ice so that Gemma got the responses and feedback she needed.

What is the point of asking for feedback or help if all you get in response is false praise and platitudes? Nobody progresses that way

caroleallen
01-05-2010, 04:58 PM
Too true Di. I hope you weren't offended Gemma. You should have seen my first attempt.

caroleallen
01-05-2010, 05:00 PM
........ and I can't do maths for toffee!

Emerald
01-05-2010, 05:36 PM
........ and I can't do maths for toffee!

i think a lot of us have worse things hidden away or even for sale lol x

Gemma as G says get youself a smooth cab to practice on x

arian
01-05-2010, 06:23 PM
That's your knuckes rapped Geti ;)

Actually, I thought it was very funny - and tbh I might not have posted at all if I hadn't been amused. I'm sure Gemma took it in the lighthearted spirit it was intended.


Do you know, if that had been me I would have been far more hurt by the deafening silence. That silence spoke a thousand words, not one of us willing or able to say what needed to be said. Geti's response hit just the right note - it wasn't malicious in any sense and, as George said up there, it served to break the ice so that Gemma got the responses and feedback she needed.

What is the point of asking for feedback or help if all you get in response is false praise and platitudes? Nobody progresses that way

I thought the posts were hurtful, condescending and unhelpful.

There was no deafening silence, just sarky comments.

The OP knew they'd got it wrong, and sought help. How many people post their failures?
Give encouragement, not mockery.

geti-titanium
01-05-2010, 07:14 PM
........ and I can't do maths for toffee!

Carole - do you remember when I reviewed your 1st website? How did that make you feel and what happened afterwards?

Emerald
01-05-2010, 07:27 PM
Arian that post had been up a long time before Geti replied and had been looked at by many people i think geti broke the ice right or wrong and i dont notice a helpful comment from yourself but as Lesley says its up to Gemma

caroleallen
01-05-2010, 08:19 PM
Yes actually Geti, I'm glad you brought that up - I was gutted. What happened afterwards was that after coming round to yours with a crowbar and sorting you out, I had my site redone and it's now loads better.

MuranoSilver
01-05-2010, 09:02 PM
Anyway - think enough said....maybe we could get back to Gemma now ;)
Gemma did that help at all? I know your work is generally fab but there's always
a bug bear. Mine was hinges (still need LOTS more practice with them)
Nic xx

Dennis
01-05-2010, 11:24 PM
Dear Gemma, Forgive me if I state the obvious but here’s what to do. For a faceted stone you need a bezel with a bearer to support it. You can buy bearer strip, but it is tricky to use, so I make a tube within a tube, the inner one about 1mm lower.
First you need some callipers so you can measure the diameter and height of your stone (preferably digital, try Lidl). Next get a cheap set of twist drills from a market, or pound shop. These will allow you to form the bezel without fiddling with your stone. They have smooth shanks from 1 1/2 to 6mm in half sizes.
Cut some bezel strip to be about 1 1/2mm wider than the height of your stone. For length, twist some thin wire around the matching drill shank, or slightly larger, cut, straighten and measure. No maths. Now you have the dimensions of your bezel, you can form it around your drill shank, take it off and solder. Turn the stone on its head to try your bezel. It should fit snugly but not tightly. If it is too loose, cut it through with a fine saw blade, about size 4/0, solder and try it again. After each cut it will be a little smaller.
Once your bezel is made, you make a second tube on a drill shank 1mm smaller in diameter
and about 1mm lower. Once your bearer fits the bezel you can pick up the stone using a cone of Bluetack, try it in and make some adjustments. The outer edge of the bezel should be only very slightly taller than the girdle of the stone, and the pointy bit(culet) should not touch bottom with the base on. When soldering is complete and the work is polished, try the stone one more time, with some dental floss underneath so you can pull if the stone gets stuck before you are ready. Make sure the table of the stone is level, use a pusher as if on the points of a compass, push down the points in between.Then burnish by rubbing round and round with the side of the same pusher. Good luck D.

caroleallen
02-05-2010, 09:01 AM
That's very good advice Dennis and succinctly put. Thankyou.

Gemma
02-05-2010, 09:58 AM
Totally not offended at all! Actually made me smile. :-D Thanks Geti for getting the ball rolling on the replies. I was starting to think you were all abandoning me!
I know should use a flat backed cab first but I like to run before I can walk. The bezel wasn't too wide but I think you're right in that it was too tall.

Thanks for all your advice and for worrying I'd be offended. You're all sweet- yes even you Geti :X I was a bit busy yest so didn't check the forum. I think this forum is great. I feel safe enough here to post disasters. I knew that you'll all have a giggle about it but I was also sure you'd be able to help me out too. As you did, so thanks muchly.

I need to get calipers. Trying to save pennies at the mo as I had to give up the day job. I did look in 2 different lidls but they didn't have any.

I had used a bearer of sorts- a jump ring soldered into place but it think its was a bit lopsided. I used a bezel rocker and tried burnishing but you need strong foundations to build a house after all..

bustagasket
02-05-2010, 11:06 AM
Gemma you sooooooooooo have the right attitude, you will go far. Good on ya gal :) xx

Di Sandland
02-05-2010, 11:24 AM
way to go Gemma (ooh I feel such a fraud using that expression at my age but it's the only one that fits!). You'll go far. xxxxx

caroleallen
02-05-2010, 01:40 PM
The thing about constructive criticism though is that when someone says they like something, you know they mean it.

Kwant
02-05-2010, 02:22 PM
Well I hope this photo makes you feel a bit better, as you are not alone :0) This was my first attempt at a bezel setting a couple of days ago. I think my problems, were, the bezel was badly centred to the hole in the back where the stone pokes through and my soldering was not up to scratch so it split, and I suspect I need a shover thing instead of using the end of a file.

Do not despair, you will get there in the end as I hope I will.

Green Beetle
02-05-2010, 02:33 PM
I've found this thread quite reassuring! My first attempt with a bezel setting the side split at the join when I was soldering it onto the base, then it was off centre when I soldered it onto the ring, then I'd cut the rim too short and had to resort to glue. Needs someone with crooked fingers and poor eyesight to wear it. Second attempt went a bit better and is actually almost wearable (stone hasn't dropped out yet and that's success in my book), third attempt seemed to encompass all known faults and I think I have chipped the stone (a lapis cab) too boot. Should probably use it to show how not to set a stone. Sigh. I wouldn't dare post a picture even if I could manage to take one not artistically out of focus ...

I think Gemma deserves a medal and a round of applause.

Gemma
02-05-2010, 04:54 PM
LOL You're all so sweet!
I don't offend easily. I used to be a maths teacher in an inner city secondary school!

As I used to say to my students- if you don't understand, tell me. You wont be the only one!

griffT
02-05-2010, 05:15 PM
Hi Gemma,

I find when I try to set stones, especially facetted stones, that I have to spend a great deal of time getting the bearer and the height of the bezel right and always takes longer than I expect. I put a chamfer on the bearer to match the stone as near as I can and try to make sure that the stone sits firmly in the setting so it doesn't move while the bezel is being rubbed over. I find that patience at these stages really pays off. I deliberately make the setting slightly smaller than needed and size it up on a ring mandrel while continuously trying the stone for size, this leaves the problem of hammer marks on the outside and only works for round stones of course.

I actually quite like the medieval look you achieved!

Nick.

Gemma
07-05-2010, 02:02 PM
Well I thought you might be interested in the results of your brilliant tips and help. Its not fantastic but a thousand times better than it was and its all down to you wonderful people. :ta:

1970

Think the bezel is still a bit high but it is MUCH neater.

mizgeorge
07-05-2010, 02:03 PM
Woohoo!
Much better Gemma :)

snow_imp
07-05-2010, 02:48 PM
Looking good Gemma!

Di Sandland
07-05-2010, 04:06 PM
oh, that's hugely improved Gemma. Well done you!

Dennis
07-05-2010, 08:34 PM
Cor, a word to the wise, obviously. D.

bustagasket
07-05-2010, 09:01 PM
Oh wow gemma that an amazing difference!! I bet you are well pleased :)

caroleallen
07-05-2010, 09:08 PM
So much better. Well done you.

Lucy
17-05-2010, 04:30 PM
It looks fabulous now - and you say its not perfect, but its nothing a rubber wheel wouldn't sort out in a jiffy :)

daisychain
17-05-2010, 06:44 PM
That is such an improvement Gemma - definitely worth sticking at it!
I'd show you my first attempts at stone setting but I dismantled them before anyone could see them, they were so bad!