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View Full Version : which anvil and where to get for open bracelets



chocolateteapot
18-03-2010, 10:06 AM
Hi, i fancied getting an anvil to make an open bracelt like this one
foret that..wont let me put a url on here yet...its bracelt...C shape slightly curved out..dont know how to explain.

i havent got much silver smithing stuff but i do fancy that bracelet style. I am slowly..as i can afford it get more bits..to start with would be a better torch like Mizgeorge suggested in here earlier, i have a litle coocksons one with is ok for little bits only. So a nice anvil to make that style of bracelt would be helpful if anyone knows where to start..thanks ..Tracy x

mizgeorge
18-03-2010, 10:14 AM
Tracy, can you put a picture in your album (on your profile page).

I wonder if you're talking about an anticlastic style? In which case you're probably after a sinusoidal stake.

chocolateteapot
18-03-2010, 10:30 AM
Hi George. you are like my fairy god sister....I have just managed to put a piccie on my profile..couldnt find one of me ...dont know how i found that...will try...i didnt know i had an album..took me awhile to find this post again actually...such a dimwit with the comp....will go and see what i can do. I defo have to get to grips with comp and phoots etc..so many jobs so little time..xxxx
So i need to but a piccie of the bracelt in my album then...ok....x

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 10:32 AM
Give me a shout if you need help with it.

chocolateteapot
18-03-2010, 10:35 AM
I think i might have done it..but i prob havent as it was all very quick.....they dont call me chocolate teapot for nothing u know....i have definately put something in my album there isnt a picture..just a link but i dont know if it works. I will try and find a oicture to put on my thingy of me instead of a bracelet..the only ones i can find of are of my kid and dogs.....dont hold your breathe..but if u do find the piccie...let me know about the anvil..xxx

MuranoSilver
18-03-2010, 10:39 AM
I've found the link it's to a Tiffany Bracelet (http://uk.tiffany.com/Shopping/Item.aspx?fromGrid=1&sku=GRP00088&mcat=148204&cid= 287458&search_params=s+5-p+14-c+287458-r+201323338-x+-n+6-ri+-ni+0-t+)
It looks more like a cast bangle to me :)

As a newbie to it it might be better to start with some thinner metal (one of those fab delrin stakes that Peter does would help too)
Here are some examples (http://www.johnsbrana.com/blog/copper-jewelry/new-textures-added-to-the-sea-cliff-jewelry-collection/) with thinner metal

Nic x

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 10:40 AM
I'm not seeing any albums in your profile, I'm afraid - what steps have you gone through to create it?

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 10:42 AM
It looks more like a cast bangle to me :)


I'd agree, that's very probably cast. It is, however, a relatively subtle anticlast, isn't it?

chocolateteapot
18-03-2010, 10:46 AM
i dont know, is it????
thanks then, what anvil should i get to make bracelts then? I dont want to buy what i think....i want to get what will actuallywork x

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 10:52 AM
Well, if it has a sort-of saddle shape, that's an anticlast (so in that bracelet, the curve that goes round the wrist is opposed by the curve that goes across the wdith of the bracelet); if the curves run in the same direction - like a bowl - it's a synclast. A sinusoidal stake and a suitable raising hammer or mallet is the usual way to form them.

mizgeorge
18-03-2010, 10:54 AM
For simple bangles, all you need is a bangel mandrel, either round or oval. Steel is expensive, hardwood much cheaper. I got by for a very long time with an old table leg and a baseball bat.... You can work with round, D or rectangular wire, or with sheet.

If you want to create anticlastic shaping (where the outer curve is perpendicular to the main curve) you need a stake. You can either get a steel sinusoidal (very pricey if it's for occasional use) or a delrin one - such as Peter's. I'm delighted with my delrin one as it allows me to use a regular cross pein hammer, rather than having to source a nylon version from the US.

There was a nice tutorial in Art Jewelry Magazine a while ago - covering both reticulation and anticlastic raising - it might be worth getting a back issue for that - it's barely more than buying the pdf version.

Art Jewelry Magazine - Issues (http://www.artjewelrymag.com/ART/Default.aspx?c=i&id=33&issue=27)

jille
18-03-2010, 10:58 AM
Hello chocolateteapot, i'm new to working with silver as well, I have made a couple of bangles, open and soldered using a bangle mandrel

Nic I didn't have a clue what anticlastic, whatever, thingamajig is so I googled it and guess what this link to Peter came up.

http://www.cooksongold.com/forum/classifieds/2058-delrin-anticlastic-stakes.html
Still don't know what this is for tho.
I love those bangles in your link, how do you get the curve on the metal before forming the bangle? i think this is what the thingamajig is for...right?
jille

chocolateteapot
18-03-2010, 10:59 AM
Thanks everyone..thanks for link Nic....they look lovely..just great....watch this space..or a space somewhere..in a few weeks...xxxxx

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 11:02 AM
You form your main curve first - so bend the metal to a bracelet shape, then you work in the anticlastic curves on a suitable stake. As you do, the metal tries to straighten out, so you have to bend the main curve back in... Which flattens out some of the anticlastic raising. And so on, ad infinitum.

I like the use of reticulation on that bracelet - might have to have a go at that.

jille
18-03-2010, 11:42 AM
Thanks Peter for the explanation.
I needed to actually see this done to get my head round the technique so i looked on youtube and found this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5_Je02rDAc

jille

Petal
18-03-2010, 11:42 AM
OOh, those bangles are absolutely GORGEOUS. I especially like the texturing, but the shape looks so tactile. Thanks for posting the pics and links.

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 12:19 PM
Thanks Peter for the explanation.

Which is completely at odds with the method used in that video :D

Interesting, though - although it looks to me like her method results in more wrinkles that have to be worked out. I'll have to have a go at doing it that way round too.

Sunnybank
18-03-2010, 12:30 PM
Peter, could you be persuaded to post a tutorial with some pics. Pretty please

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 12:36 PM
What sort of thing? A simple anticlastic cuff bracelet or something more involved?

(No, I am not doing one in mokume! :-p )

Sunnybank
18-03-2010, 12:39 PM
What sort of thing? A simple anticlastic cuff bracelet or something more involved?

(No, I am not doing one in mokume! :-p )

Personally I would quite like a simple anticlastic cuff, so I can walk before I run.

(would look wonderful on mokume!!!)

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 12:44 PM
OK, I shall try and get something done. Not this evening though, I have new saws to play with tonight.

Sunnybank
18-03-2010, 12:53 PM
Thank you, I'll look forward to it, did you say you were making some more stakes?

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 12:53 PM
Marked out & ready to start cutting.

Sunnybank
18-03-2010, 01:02 PM
I could very well become a customer.

Lisa Quinn
18-03-2010, 01:05 PM
I could very well become a customer.

Me too !! Be sure to let us know when you have a batch ready !

jille
18-03-2010, 01:07 PM
Yes Peter I noticed she did this the opposite way to your explanation, I'm of the firm believe........... 'whatever works for you'
Looking forward to your tutorial, and if you sell those stakes i may be interested. I'm just about to move to Yorkshire so i'm a bit strapped for cash just now
jille

lorraineflee
18-03-2010, 01:36 PM
This is one I made for the Secret Santa at Christmas

MuranoSilver
18-03-2010, 01:38 PM
I love that :)

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 01:40 PM
Me too - what's the texture?

Petal
18-03-2010, 01:45 PM
Yep, I may well find an excuse to buy one from you too Peter. Can't wait for the Tut too !!!

Sunnybank
18-03-2010, 01:53 PM
Lovely Lorraine :)

lorraineflee
18-03-2010, 01:53 PM
Me too - what's the texture?

It was some handmade paper, through my rolling mill.
Lorraine

Sunnybank
18-03-2010, 01:57 PM
Thanks for asking the question chocolateteapot, this has been on my list of to try for a while, but never got round to asking.

chocolateteapot
18-03-2010, 02:00 PM
Thanks...wondered how u meant to use that stake....thanks all ..x

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 02:03 PM
It was some handmade paper, through my rolling mill.


It looks really nice - a great organic feel to it.

Sunnybank
18-03-2010, 03:01 PM
Thanks...wondered how u meant to use that stake....thanks all ..x

Hopefully Peter's tutorial will explain all ..............

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 03:14 PM
"Some" only, I'm afraid... :) If you want "all", have a look at Form Emphasis for Metalsmiths to start with.

chocolateteapot
18-03-2010, 03:40 PM
Do u recommend that book then Peter? What about Hot and Cold Connections? Was looking on Amazon and they are recommended to buy together..naturally...just wonderd what you thought? x

ps_bond
18-03-2010, 03:48 PM
It's a fairly advanced metalsmithing book; depends on your tastes, really.
Have a look at Google's preview of it - Form emphasis for metalsmiths - Google Books (http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=QpQgPb-_VDsC&pg=PA96&lpg=PA96)

Hot & Cold Connections is excellent, although I don't refer to my copy all that often.

vsilvered
19-03-2010, 07:15 PM
Marked out & ready to start cutting.

Hi Peter,

Please could I put my name down for one of your small delrin stakes?

Tabby66
19-03-2010, 08:12 PM
Hi Peter,

I was wondering how to get that effect on a bangle too. I've been trying (and failing!) with copper. Now you've all started to answer my questions! Will be interested in your tutorial Peter and may well be interested in a stake too (how many are you making?!!).
Tabby

caroleallen
19-03-2010, 09:34 PM
I used to make anticlastic bangles on a stake, though not quite the same way as in the tutorial. I found that if I soldered the 2 ends of the bangle and shaped it first, it kept it's shape much better when I was forging it. Once it was made, I cut it open where I had soldered it.

I now make them on my fantastic Bonny Doon and it takes about 20 seconds to do. Cheating I know, but who cares.

caroleallen
19-03-2010, 09:39 PM
And also it's great for forming aluminium.

Di Sandland
20-03-2010, 07:30 AM
Carole, that's bloody brilliant! Tropical paradise on a wrist.

mizgeorge
20-03-2010, 07:50 AM
Those are gorgeous Carole - I've got tool envy again now!

jille
20-03-2010, 09:00 AM
Stunning work and so different
Jille

caroleallen
20-03-2010, 10:14 AM
Thanks guys. That's a great slogan Di, I may use that in the future!

MuranoSilver
20-03-2010, 10:21 AM
I used to make anticlastic bangles on a stake, though not quite the same way as in the tutorial. I found that if I soldered the 2 ends of the bangle and shaped it first, it kept it's shape much better when I was forging it. Once it was made, I cut it open where I had soldered it.

I now make them on my fantastic Bonny Doon and it takes about 20 seconds to do. Cheating I know, but who cares.

So beautiful!

caroleallen
20-03-2010, 11:00 AM
Jille, I've just looked at your sites. What stunning work. Like me, you like to do lots of different things.

jille
20-03-2010, 11:20 AM
Hi Carole, thank you
I get bored easily and so i have to keep learning new skills. I love overglaze painting but sadly it doesn't sell, glass does much better. I'm hoping once i have silver making skills I can combine glass, ceramics, silver and enamels but I'm not exactly sure how just yet
Jille

Petal
20-03-2010, 11:33 AM
And also it's great for forming aluminium.


WOW, absolutely stunning colours Carole.

xx

Gemma
22-03-2010, 09:36 PM
I now make them on my fantastic Bonny Doon and it takes about 20 seconds to do. Cheating I know, but who cares.

Ok...I'll admit it, I'm being a total noob but "Bonny Doon"?

Gorgeous bangles Carole <3<3

caroleallen
23-03-2010, 07:48 AM
Hi Gemma. This is the link for the Bonny Doon Bonny Doon Engineering Hydraulic Presses and Tooling for Metalsmiths and Jewelers (http://www.bonnydoonengineering.com/)

A fantastic piece of kit but sooooo expensive. I only got it to do the aluminium cuffs which I couldn't do easily any other way. I haven't really had time to experiment much further with it but I've got loads of bits and bobs to use when I do (whenever that might be!).

mizgeorge
23-03-2010, 08:53 AM
I noticed the Bonny Doon class coming up at West Dean and had to stop myself Carole! I have SUCH tool envy on that one ;)

Jayne
23-03-2010, 09:03 AM
okay, I know this isn't the correct terminology, but can you 'cut stuff out' on a bonny doon?
xx

ps_bond
23-03-2010, 09:08 AM
Using pancake dies, for example? Or disc cutters?
Yes to both.

Gemma
23-03-2010, 09:25 AM
Thanks Carole
Wow! Very envious too! I think we should all descend on Carole's house/workshop to drool over her tools!
I think the first bit of expensive kit I need is a rolling mill ... I definately can't afford a Bonny Doon :dance:

lorraineflee
23-03-2010, 09:25 AM
Hi Gemma. This is the link for the Bonny Doon Bonny Doon Engineering Hydraulic Presses and Tooling for Metalsmiths and Jewelers (http://www.bonnydoonengineering.com/)

A fantastic piece of kit but sooooo expensive. I only got it to do the aluminium cuffs which I couldn't do easily any other way. I haven't really had time to experiment much further with it but I've got loads of bits and bobs to use when I do (whenever that might be!).
Carole, do you think that the bracelet forming kit could be attached to a platen that doesn't have the facility to take bolts - my press has a solid upper platen and the kits are a bit pricy to buy on the off-chance!
What do you reckon?
Lorraine